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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2012 7:25:33 GMT -6
BP, we seem to hear that every year and nothing changes.
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Post by yuhayden on Feb 13, 2012 9:26:42 GMT -6
Well, at least the the Fairborn/Dayton question has been resolved.
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Post by 2543nick on Feb 13, 2012 11:59:45 GMT -6
Glad to see we are back to mediocrity where half the board makes excuses and the other half has a leave of their senses. Sorry, I'm having a leave too. I'm sure I'm not a real fan because of it though.
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Post by PantherU on Feb 13, 2012 13:07:22 GMT -6
BP, we seem to hear that every year and nothing changes. What are you talking about? When Ricky Franklin was point guard, this team scored at a higher clip (and gave up points at a higher clip), and relied more on the transition offense than the current style. This team is slower, more deliberate, and milks the clock more than any team we've had under coach. It's different from last year in that they rely more on drives to the basket than they did in the championship season last season. Next year, the style of play picks up to match the point guard and other personnel (read: Gulley) that they have on the court. There are a lot of things that you can complain about, but the style of play, as far as being different year-to-year, isn't one of them. You have quite the selective memory if you think this is how our offense has ran the entire time during Jeter's tenure. |
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Post by BBFran on Feb 13, 2012 13:09:12 GMT -6
Fortunately I was on a train on Sunday and didn't hear or see the game.
As one of the few Milwaukee fans at the Detroit game I can tell you that the team looks like a MASH unit right now, and the way they lost that game was devastating. So I can't say I'm shocked that they had nothing left against WSU. They need to heal and regroup in a hurry, obviously. We'll see soon enough if they can.
As for the nonsense about firing Rob, that's just dumb-ass venting. This is the same staff that got us a title last year. Rob isn't going anywhere. Every program has setback years, but this staff will get us moving in the right direction again. The only people who truly have reason to want Rob to go are the other coaches in the league, because they know Milwaukee will be a contender and a tough out as long as he's here.
Edited to add that BP is right -- if anyone thinks we are still running the same offense the same way that we were a year ago or five years ago, please report to the chalkboard to demonstrate. Like any good coach and staff, we modify how we play to fit the personnel at hand. Kaylon himself will tell you that he plays "old man" basketball. Ricky played differently. Shaq and Jordan will play differently.
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Post by PantherU on Feb 13, 2012 13:44:15 GMT -6
I think the problem is that we've got some people who are seeing scores and base everything they talk about off of that.
They aren't posting recently, so I'm assuming they aren't aware of the injury situation.
Let me break it down.
Take the Sweet 16 team of 2004-05. Ed McCants, your best player, has bad knee tendonitis that not only slows him down for the latter half of January and the rest of the season, but he's actually limping and the right collision can cause him to miss much of the game. Imagine you put your small forward, Joah Tucker, on the opposing team's best player. He did a whole lot of high flying but has been hampered by leg injuries the last couple months that has severely limited his production, especially since he's asked to score in the post, slashing inside, and cover the best scorer. There's no time for a break, so he's especially ragged. Then your best post defender and scorer, Adrian Tigert, not only has a shoulder injury that he's still recovering from but a stress fracture in his foot that is really hampering for basketball players. On top of that, one of your best 3PT shooters, Boo Davis, missed the beginning of the season with a leg injury that only recently got to 100%, so he's still trying to find his consistent stroke from long range.
Does that sound like a Sweet 16 team to you?
I don't like making excuses. But if there's one thing you can say about Bruce Pearl's tournament teams, they were remarkably lucky to avoid major injuries. This year's team has not been anywhere near as lucky.
It's obvious how much better this team is healthy, because all you have to do is look back one month ago to see the Panthers were in first place in the conference and beat the current first-place team, Valpo, on the road in a tough environment.
Hence my post today on PantherU.com. If the Panthers are best when they are healthy, then perhaps the priorities of the team should be to get healthy. That's why it might not be a bad idea to shut down Williams, Haarsma, Allen and Kelm for the Bracketbuster game (which is completely irrelevant) and the UIC and Loyola games, which are winnable.
If the Panthers can pull off a victory at home tomorrow, I say they shut down those four until at least Monday, preferably Tuesday, to give them as much a chance to heal up as possible.
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Post by FTA1982 on Feb 13, 2012 13:50:31 GMT -6
I think the problem is that we've got some people who are seeing scores and base everything they talk about off of that. They aren't posting recently, so I'm assuming they aren't aware of the injury situation. Let me break it down. Take the Sweet 16 team of 2004-05. Ed McCants, your best player, has bad knee tendonitis that not only slows him down for the latter half of January and the rest of the season, but he's actually limping and the right collision can cause him to miss much of the game. Imagine you put your small forward, Joah Tucker, on the opposing team's best player. He did a whole lot of high flying but has been hampered by leg injuries the last couple months that has severely limited his production, especially since he's asked to score in the post, slashing inside, and cover the best scorer. There's no time for a break, so he's especially ragged. Then your best post defender and scorer, Adrian Tigert, not only has a shoulder injury that he's still recovering from but a stress fracture in his foot that is really hampering for basketball players. On top of that, one of your best 3PT shooters, Boo Davis, missed the beginning of the season with a leg injury that only recently got to 100%, so he's still trying to find his consistent stroke from long range. Does that sound like a Sweet 16 team to you? Both teams healthy, the Sweet 16 beats this team by 10+ points. How many times would 2011-2012 turn the ball over vs. the 2004-2005 team's press? 2004-2005 is way more talented than 2011-2012. |
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Post by The Green Gull on Feb 13, 2012 13:52:51 GMT -6
Rob Jeter’s record as head coach since his second season has been 94-92 (89-92 against other division 1 teams). This may be dumb-ass venting but to me this record seems pretty mediocre.
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Post by PantherU on Feb 13, 2012 14:00:52 GMT -6
Both teams healthy, the Sweet 16 beats this team by 10+ points. How many times would 2011-2012 turn the ball over vs. the 2004-2005 team's press? 2004-2005 is way more talented than 2011-2012. Well, now we know you're not paying too much attention. Teams didn't press the Panthers consistently until the end of last month. Why? Because every time they tried before then, the Panthers broke the press easily. This is the truth. I agree that the 2004-05 team would win head to head, but not because this team isn't talented. They'd win because they've got too many offensive pieces that can score 20+ points - Ed, Joah, Boo, and AT all could achieve that - and this year's team wouldn't be able to go man to man. Ryan Allen shutting down Joah Tucket isn't out of the question, but then you're relying on Paris Gulley to guard Ed and that's not going to yield the same results. Of course, if we're talking Horizon League referees, who knows what the outcome would be when they dislike both teams  |
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Post by PantherU on Feb 13, 2012 14:06:05 GMT -6
Rob Jeter’s record as head coach since his second season has been 94-92 (89-92 against other division 1 teams). This may be dumb-ass venting but to me this record seems pretty mediocre. We've been over this a million times before. When you are forced to build a program with Al Hanson, Nick Hansen, Derrick Wimmer, Steve Hoelzel, Michael Bendall, Luke Homan, and Myles McKay, that's akin to building from scratch. You can argue that Bruce didn't leave the cupboard bare all you want, but his departure did cause at least Ryan Childress to leave with him and hampered recruiting for the first year, as it is with every program. If you were a big Mike Dunlap fan, you have to admit that he would also have had to use a magic wand to keep the team at the level it was playing at or even close to it. If Bruce had stayed, he probably would have brought in a bunch of JUCO's to help the situation, but I don't think the 06-07 team would have beaten Butler or Wright State anyways. |
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Post by PantherU on Feb 13, 2012 14:08:28 GMT -6
Here's a stat: only three players on this team have appeared in every game this season.
Edit: conversely, the 2004-05 team had eight players play in 30 games (they played 32).
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Post by The Green Gull on Feb 13, 2012 14:33:04 GMT -6
Rob Jeter is what he is. He’s a mediocre head basketball coach. If you negate his first two seasons as head coach his record against other division 1 schools, including this season, is 80-70, that’s not exactly setting the world on fire. This program needs a program builder who can bring life back to this program and can bring an exciting brand of basketball to the community as well. The best teams in this school's history has always played fast paced, full court, pressure defense dating back to the days of Steve Antrim to Bruce Pearl. I think this program has potential to be truly great and it sickens me to see this apathetic, plain coach make this program just a mediocre, run of the mill, mid-major program. It’s always a treat to open up the newspaper and see that Jeter has said this about his team’s performance: "We talk about making people take tough twos and that's exactly what they did to us," Jeter said of his team's shooting problems. "We took tough twos and contested threes all night." www.jsonline.com/sports/panthers/139190794.htmlLet’s get a coach that can bring excitement back to this program with athletes that can score with fast pace action as well. |
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Post by uwm97 on Feb 13, 2012 14:40:00 GMT -6
So because we replace Kaylon Williams with Jordan Aaron we're going to run more next year? I'm not buying that for a second. Hell, Jeter didn't let the 2006 team play its style consistently until the last month of that season, and they were coming off of a Sweet 16 for God's sakes. Go back and read some of the game threads for that year if you don't remember. Are James Haarsma and Kyle Kelm going to somehow transform into gazelles because Aaron is manning the point? The team is playing the style of basketball the coach prefers. It's not as though Kaylon showed up on the team one day, Jeter knew what kind of player he was and brought him in. Same with Kelm, Haarsma and Meier.
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Post by The Green Gull on Feb 13, 2012 14:42:33 GMT -6
I agree that it’s going to be extremely difficult, if not impossible, to fire Jeter because of his remaining contract. It seems that the only way Jeter leaves the program is by his own accord. I think there are two scenarios in which Jeter would leave voluntarily that would work out positively for both Jeter and the Milwaukee basketball program. - Jeter gets offered a head coaching position at another school and takes the offer. He had a decent amount of interest from various schools after last year, and hopefully the team can finish the season strong, so that he can parlay that to another offer. He probably won’t get a high major offer this time around. Although the Nebraska job might be vacant and the Huskers might be interested in a coach with head coaching experience with solid Midwest connections now that they are in the Big Ten.
- Jeter voluntary resigns and either becomes a lead assistant coach at a BCS program or becomes a television analyst. Jeter has a lot of good experience and I’m sure he would be a leading candidate for a lot of high profile assistant coaching positions throughout the country and specifically in the Midwest. If all else fails I’m sure Bo would love to have him back on his bench.
I appreciate that Coach Jeter is running a clean program and Jeter has laid a nice foundation for the program as well. I think after seven years as head coach, it’s time for both parties to move on. I would love to see another head coach come in and build on the foundation that Jeter has built here and take the program to an even better level. |
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Post by yuhayden on Feb 13, 2012 14:42:57 GMT -6
"We've been over this a million times before. When you are forced to build a program with Al Hanson, Nick Hansen, Derrick Wimmer, Steve Hoelzel, Michael Bendall, Luke Homan, and Myles McKay, that's akin to building from scratch.
You can argue that Bruce didn't leave the cupboard bare all you want, but his departure did cause at least Ryan Childress to leave with him and hampered recruiting for the first year, as it is with every program."
So, Pearl cleared out, UWM goes to the tournament and beats Oklahoma in Jeter's first year, he is the toast of the tourney, turns down Iowa State but he doesn't use that season to ramp up recruiting and "is forced to build a program with Al Hanson, Nick Hansen, Derrick Wimmer, Steve Hoelzel, Michael Bendall, Luke Homan, and Myles McKay?" What about Tyrone Young? Was he "forced" to rebuild with him?
How is that different from across town when Crean took off and left the big three for a year (and MU lost all of Crean's commits) and then Williams brought in his own guys? Or when Bennett left Wisconsin and left Ryan with Charlie Wills(!)?
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