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Post by uwm97 on Dec 4, 2012 18:07:29 GMT -6
At this point, who really gives a rat's ass about a new arena? The biggest thing I took from that article was the fact this department has a structural deficit of at least $500,000. The reason for this is quite obvious: there is one revenue sport that doesn't take in nearly enough revenue compared to what it spends, and that is men's basketball. You have a coach who's the highest-paid in the conference and, really, what exactly does the university have to show for it? If the school was making periodic appearances in the NCAA and drawing, say, 6000 fans/game, obviously the revenue would be much higher and the coach's exorbitant salary would be justified. Anybody who's run a budget can do a simple cost/benefit analysis and determine the university is simply not getting the best bang for its buck with respect to Rob Jeter.
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Post by skrapheap on Dec 4, 2012 18:51:20 GMT -6
Absolutely not. Jeter needs at least three more Rose Bowls. |
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Post by kingsteve on Dec 5, 2012 10:14:42 GMT -6
Bingo UWM 97!!
Any comparison between Bielema and Rob is ridiculous. Expectations much lower here and that is ok but holy cow...The Rob apologists got what they deserve unfortunatley... seven years of HL hell , missed opportunities, flagging interest, under achieving fund raising levels, subpar promotion and what is the result?? Lost a lot of buzz locally, opportunity to increase profile including possibly conference affiliation, increasing donor involvement and athletic funding and now we are at the KC, have a huge deficit, flagging interest and no immediate plans for a decent basketball facility...what could have been..as far as fairness...look...we seem to be sliding now...what we have gotten looks like what we are going to get...we are not being unrealistic in asking and expecting a lousy NCAA bid once in awhile. It has not happened with his own recruits..Bielema got success beyond Alvarez's recruits...I see us farther away now from an NCAA bid.. just think what one much less a couple bids during this tenure would have done for elevating this program..now way back again with lower interest, back at KC, less buzz..subpar fundraising and deficit...Rob is a great and ethical guy but running a program?? He has not defined his own identify or legacy...just a Bo Ryan disicple...great... now good enough...time to move on.. new AD, new coach after the season to create some new buzz for the supposed fund raising initiative Geiger is going to run... I don't see unless we somehow pull off an NCAA bid this year how the fund raising potential donors are going to be excited about opening up the wallets for another year of boring, underachieving pablum
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Post by uwm97 on Dec 5, 2012 12:34:11 GMT -6
Comparing Jeter to Bielema is a leap of absurd proportions. Bielema never had a losing record, maintained the program's identity built by his predecessor, and even added the element of a passing game through Tolzien and Wilson (and soon Bart Houston) that surpassed anything Alvarez threw out there. And next year might have been his best team ever (not to mention his 0.73 winning %). To compare that resume with that of Rob Jeter's (which is basically nothing with his own guys) is an exercise only somebody with no argument would attempt to make.
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Post by BBFran on Dec 5, 2012 13:28:49 GMT -6
I'm shocked that you guys feel this way. It's only the 100th time you have said the exact same thing.  I'm old, and over the years I have noticed that every fanbase has a segment of fans whose one true passion is to call for the head of the coach. Doesn't matter if he's doing poorly, well or just so-so. It's a mindset. The guy in the stands or watching the game is the expert, and the guy on the bench is an idiot. The game is so simple, right? Sports radio and message boards wouldn't exist if so many fans didn't have that conceit. I don't pretend to be that smart. I know a little about basketball but I'm no expert. It's just entertainment to me and a way to stay connected with my alma mater. So as long as Rob's our coach I'm going to support him. I'll try to support the next guy too, even if he's not as good a coach as Rob, which is at least as likely to be the case, as long as he runs a clean program with good people. The next Panther game I go to (and I go to every game that I can) that I don't enjoy will be the first. Do losses or poor play frustrate me? Sure. But I still enjoy supporting the kids and the coaches, and mere losses don't get in my way. Life is hard. Being a basketball fan is easy. If you don't enjoy going to a game because of the possibility of a loss you should find a different way to spend your time. You aren't cut out for sports. Try knitting or bird watching. All that aside, the challenges for our program go far beyond who the coach is. There is no coach out there who could solve them by himself. For all the success he had here Bruce kept his bags packed and was ready to flee at the first opportunity. And who could blame him? There's no donor waving a $50M check to build an arena if only we win a couple more games, reach the tournament or hire the ghost of Paul Westhead. I wish there was but it doesn't work that way. That doesn't mean we shouldn't aspire to do better on the court. Of course we should. But when I read the tiresome complaints about Rob, who has had a solid if unspectacular tenure, it's very hard for me not to see that he's just a convenient whipping boy for a subset of fans who should actually be more disturbed by structural problems decades in the making. |
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Post by tyrunner0097 on Dec 5, 2012 13:37:59 GMT -6
I'm shocked that you guys feel this way. It's only the 100th time you have said the exact same thing. I'm old, and over the years I have noticed that every fanbase has a segment of fans whose one true passion is to call for the head of the coach. Doesn't matter if he's doing poorly, well or just so-so. It's a mindset. The guy in the stands or watching the game is the expert, and the guy on the bench is an idiot. The game is so simple, right? Sports radio and message boards wouldn't exist if so many fans didn't have that conceit. I don't pretend to be that smart. I know a little about basketball but I'm no expert. It's just entertainment to me and a way to stay connected with my alma mater. So as long as Rob's our coach I'm going to support him. I'll try to support the next guy too, even if he's not as good a coach as Rob, which is at least as likely to be the case, as long as he runs a clean program with good people. The next Panther game I go to (and I go to every game that I can) that I don't enjoy will be the first. Do losses or poor play frustrate me? Sure. But I still enjoy supporting the kids and the coaches, and mere losses don't get in my way. Life is hard. Being a basketball fan is easy. If you don't enjoy going to a game because of the possibility of a loss you should find a different way to spend your time. You aren't cut out for sports. Try knitting or bird watching. All that aside, the challenges for our program go far beyond who the coach is. There is no coach out there who could solve them by himself. For all the success he had here Bruce kept his bags packed and was ready to flee at the first opportunity. And who could blame him? There's no donor waving a $50M check to build an arena if only we win a couple more games, reach the tournament or hire the ghost of Paul Westhead. I wish there was but it doesn't work that way. That doesn't mean we shouldn't aspire to do better on the court. Of course we should. But when I read the tiresome complaints about Rob, who has had a solid if unspectacular tenure, it's very hard for me not to see that he's just a convenient whipping boy for a subset of fans who should actually be more disturbed by structural problems decades in the making. THANK YOU! |
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Post by yuhayden on Dec 5, 2012 14:13:23 GMT -6
I'm shocked that you guys feel this way. It's only the 100th time you have said the exact same thing. I'm old, and over the years I have noticed that every fanbase has a segment of fans whose one true passion is to call for the head of the coach. Doesn't matter if he's doing poorly, well or just so-so. It's a mindset. The guy in the stands or watching the game is the expert, and the guy on the bench is an idiot. The game is so simple, right? Sports radio and message boards wouldn't exist if so many fans didn't have that conceit. I don't pretend to be that smart. I know a little about basketball but I'm no expert. It's just entertainment to me and a way to stay connected with my alma mater. So as long as Rob's our coach I'm going to support him. I'll try to support the next guy too, even if he's not as good a coach as Rob, which is at least as likely to be the case, as long as he runs a clean program with good people. The next Panther game I go to (and I go to every game that I can) that I don't enjoy will be the first. Do losses or poor play frustrate me? Sure. But I still enjoy supporting the kids and the coaches, and mere losses don't get in my way. Life is hard. Being a basketball fan is easy. If you don't enjoy going to a game because of the possibility of a loss you should find a different way to spend your time. You aren't cut out for sports. Try knitting or bird watching. All that aside, the challenges for our program go far beyond who the coach is. There is no coach out there who could solve them by himself. For all the success he had here Bruce kept his bags packed and was ready to flee at the first opportunity. And who could blame him? There's no donor waving a $50M check to build an arena if only we win a couple more games, reach the tournament or hire the ghost of Paul Westhead. I wish there was but it doesn't work that way. That doesn't mean we shouldn't aspire to do better on the court. Of course we should. But when I read the tiresome complaints about Rob, who has had a solid if unspectacular tenure, it's very hard for me not to see that he's just a convenient whipping boy for a subset of fans who should actually be more disturbed by structural problems decades in the making. Speaking of saying the same thing for the hundredth time...  Ryan and Pearl both won much more and had teams that played so much more consistently despite fewer resources. Maybe the fact that their bags were packed served as motivation for them to actually develop players. I also am amused that the current coach should not be criticized, due "structural problems", but that his relatively rich contract and his lack of success in tapping revenue streams, i.e. enthusiastic donors and NCAA tourney revenue have significantly contributed to aforementioned "structural problems". |
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Post by illwauk on Dec 5, 2012 14:38:11 GMT -6
Honestly, I'd prefer the Panthers adopt a Villanova-type schedule where most of their games are on campus, but a small-handful of important games take place at a bigger downtown arena. In hindsight, that's probably what we should've been doing all along. Nova sellouts on campus at 6,500, there "big games gets 15,000+. What big attendance games do the Panthers have other than Wisconsin & HL tourney? I would suspect that as long as the Panthers are willing to schedule 3-for-1s or 4-for-1s, like they did for Marquette, we could get a traditional basketball power (Georgetown, Kentucky, North Carolina, etc.) to come to the Cell each year and make an annual event out of it. There's even some relatively solid opponents (Cincy, Mizzou) that have been willing to do 2-for-1's with us in the past. The Green Bay game could also probably draw much bigger numbers if they ever found a way to market it effectively. Given the proximity of UWGB and the amount of alumni of both schools who live in the MKE area, there's no reason why it couldn't at least come close to selling out the Cell on an annual basis. Give it a clever name... create a rivalry trophy... give it a permanent spot on the schedule (say, last Saturday before the HL tournament) akin to a rivalry game in football... interest the mayors of each city (or chancellors of each school) in putting up a bet of a case of Lakefront beer (because f**k Miller) against a Northeast Wisconsin cheese basket. I'm shocked that you guys feel this way. It's only the 100th time you have said the exact same thing. I'm old, and over the years I have noticed that every fanbase has a segment of fans whose one true passion is to call for the head of the coach. Doesn't matter if he's doing poorly, well or just so-so. It's a mindset. The guy in the stands or watching the game is the expert, and the guy on the bench is an idiot. The game is so simple, right? Sports radio and message boards wouldn't exist if so many fans didn't have that conceit. If you honestly see the things that are being said about Jeter at these boards as evidence of THAT, then I really don't even know what to say to you. Suffice to say many of the people who are talking negatively about Jeter would implore me to keep giving him a chance in the not-so-distant past... and >I'm< certianly not the type of fan who casually calls for a coaches head. But there's no reason why a guy who inherited the program Jeter did should've taken no less than 4 years to get back to the tournament. The fact that he's been able to do just well enough (according to our revolving AD's) to keep his job for another 4 years despite STILL no return to the NCAA's is more than a valid reason to want to see him gone. Quality coaches do not squander away a decade an a half's worth of momentum the way he did. |
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Post by Pounce Needs Pals on Dec 5, 2012 15:07:50 GMT -6
Kentucky is going to play a home & home or 3 for 1 with UWM, but not Indiana?
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Post by uwm97 on Dec 5, 2012 18:23:51 GMT -6
And of course Fran, as is his long-standing MO, chooses to impugn the motives of those critical of the head coach rather than respond to legitimate points raised. It's a very common tactic for hack politicians on the wrong side of an issue of which a defense is, well, indefensible. Nowhere in Fran's sermon did you see a defense of Jeter's contract relative to his accomplishments. And, of course, you won't. But I sure did enjoy his attempt at misdirection.
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Post by illwauk on Dec 5, 2012 19:35:51 GMT -6
Kentucky is going to play a home & home or 3 for 1 with UWM, but not Indiana? ...or a 4 for 1. Honestly, I'm not sure either way. But if we're willing to make ridiculous deals like that.. or the 7 for 2 we did for Madison... we could probably get some much better competition to Milwaukee than UW and MU. And of course Fran, as is his long-standing MO, chooses to impugn the motives of those critical of the head coach rather than respond to legitimate points raised. It's a very common tactic for hack politicians on the wrong side of an issue of which a defense is, well, indefensible. Nowhere in Fran's sermon did you see a defense of Jeter's contract relative to his accomplishments. And, of course, you won't. But I sure did enjoy his attempt at misdirection. This. Not even sure what his point was other than he's ambivalent to whether or not the Milwaukee basketball program grows or remains stagnant. |
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Post by FTA1982 on Dec 6, 2012 10:00:13 GMT -6
I'm shocked that you guys feel this way. It's only the 100th time you have said the exact same thing. I'm old, and over the years I have noticed that every fanbase has a segment of fans whose one true passion is to call for the head of the coach. Doesn't matter if he's doing poorly, well or just so-so. It's a mindset. The guy in the stands or watching the game is the expert, and the guy on the bench is an idiot. The game is so simple, right? Sports radio and message boards wouldn't exist if so many fans didn't have that conceit. I don't pretend to be that smart. I know a little about basketball but I'm no expert. It's just entertainment to me and a way to stay connected with my alma mater. So as long as Rob's our coach I'm going to support him. I'll try to support the next guy too, even if he's not as good a coach as Rob, which is at least as likely to be the case, as long as he runs a clean program with good people. The next Panther game I go to (and I go to every game that I can) that I don't enjoy will be the first. Do losses or poor play frustrate me? Sure. But I still enjoy supporting the kids and the coaches, and mere losses don't get in my way. Life is hard. Being a basketball fan is easy. If you don't enjoy going to a game because of the possibility of a loss you should find a different way to spend your time. You aren't cut out for sports. Try knitting or bird watching. All that aside, the challenges for our program go far beyond who the coach is. There is no coach out there who could solve them by himself. For all the success he had here Bruce kept his bags packed and was ready to flee at the first opportunity. And who could blame him? There's no donor waving a $50M check to build an arena if only we win a couple more games, reach the tournament or hire the ghost of Paul Westhead. I wish there was but it doesn't work that way. That doesn't mean we shouldn't aspire to do better on the court. Of course we should. But when I read the tiresome complaints about Rob, who has had a solid if unspectacular tenure, it's very hard for me not to see that he's just a convenient whipping boy for a subset of fans who should actually be more disturbed by structural problems decades in the making. "Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul." |
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Post by 2543nick on Dec 6, 2012 11:52:46 GMT -6
Someone has taken a leave of their senses.
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Post by milwsport on Dec 8, 2012 12:32:23 GMT -6
I agree with Fran but only to a point. I can enjoy a game even if we lose but seeing games where the team just mails it in is not enjoyable at least not to me.
Due to financial circumstances I haven't been able to attend any games in person, but I have watched a few online. What I've seen is troubling to me.
The team should realize that we aren't all students, we take time out of our schedules, find a parking space and walk a few blocks to get to the Klotsche Center. There should NEVER be a game where it appears that the few fans in attendance put in more effort to be there than the team they came to support is putting in on the floor.
That's insulting, not only to the school but to the fans as well. It's troubling to read players saying they didn't buy into the scouting reports. It's hard to phantom losing to teams like Buffalo and Jacksonville.
Certainly the move back to the high school gym didn't help recruiting any. Perhaps Rob is taking chances on the few players with any talent that he can get and made some misjudgements on the willingness of his recruits to buy into what he's selling.
But regardless of the reason, like many other fans, I find the UWM Panthers painful to watch. Not because of the losses but because of how and why we are losing.
The move back to the K, the falling attendance etc are part of the hand that was dealt us. If Rob isn't able to play that hand more effectively then maybe it's time to find someone else who can.
Not now in the middle of the season but after the season. We simply can't afford to pay his salary and pay someone else at the same time.
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dutchpthr
Junior
ain't much if it ain't dutch
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Post by dutchpthr on Dec 8, 2012 14:53:43 GMT -6
If Rob isn't able to play that hand more effectively then maybe it's time to find someone else who can. Not now in the middle of the season but after the season. We simply can't afford to pay his salary and pay someone else at the same time. the problem tho is still if they fire Rob in the offseason they will still be paying him until 2016 i believe so we will be fronting the bill for too coaches no matter what if he gets fired, and with the financial situation we are in i can't see this being a road they want to go down.... |
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