BU-UW

[uwmfutbol]

Mar 20, 2011 13:47:40 GMT -6 buppie05 said:

If you are pulling for an outcome that directly hurts the panthers, then please go **** yourself. Thats my opinion.

You're entitled to your opinion, but this accomplishes nothing.

[buppie05]

Mar 20, 2011 13:29:39 GMT -6 PantherU said:

Mar 20, 2011 12:25:25 GMT -6 GoPanthers33 said:

But no one and trust me when I say it no one can tell me I am not a die hard black and gold panther/

A die hard black and gold panther should realize that any victory for Green Bay is a defeat for our program because we fight for recognition, and more importantly recruits, at every turn.

futbol, you may be right in that it would be the final step and not the first, but it's still a step that absolutely must be taken.

+1

Just as Josh Gasser would look good in a panther uniform. You can't tell me Gasser wasn't on our radar, or that it wasn't a realistic possibility that he could come here. Do you think if Wisconsin gets knocked out by Butler that even 1% of their fans will say, "well at least we still have in state team in the field, go Marquette!". No and they shouldn't. Not unless they have no problem with the Wes Matthews and Vander Blue of the world leaving town to go to MU.

[PantherU]

Mar 20, 2011 13:37:15 GMT -6 uwmfutbol said:

Nevertheless, above all else I believe what is hampering this program is the lack of interest in the sports, the academics and research, and the University's growth in general. When those associated with the school couldn't care less about what happens there, nothing changes.

And why do the people at school not care? Wouldn't the success of the "big brother" be a big reason? Didn't you just say yourself that you hate students who only have eyes for UW or MU?

[PantherU]

Mar 20, 2011 13:42:55 GMT -6 GoPanthers33 said:

Mar 20, 2011 13:29:39 GMT -6 PantherU said:

A die hard black and gold panther should realize that any victory for Green Bay is a defeat for our program because we fight for recognition, and more importantly recruits, at every turn.

futbol, you may be right in that it would be the final step and not the first, but it's still a step that absolutely must be taken.

I just don't think we are in a fight for name recognition. Do we fight for recruits yes but lets see:

NCAA appearances in last decade?

Green Bay- 0
Milwaukee- 3

I think we are above them as a program due to more recent success. Did I say I root for them greatly? No. But in the non-con I will as it makes the state look good and makes the Horizon league look good as well.

Try to rip on my Panther pride all you want but all that matters to me is what I know and feel with my team.

I'm not ripping your Panther Pride, I'm saying that you should realize how a successful GB program is a deterrent to your own.

[gman2]

With a few exceptions, all the Badgers fans I know could care less about Milwaukee or MU. On the other hand, I know a lot of MU fans and Milwaukee fans who are Wisc-Madison fans. If the fans I know are a sample, UW fans in general are close minded in their ability to cheer for other teams, it's either Bucky or nothing. They will not cheer for Green Bay, Milwaukee or MU.

I hope the ending to the game on Thursday is an enjoyable as the ending to the Rose Bowl.

GO BULLDOGS !!!

[uwmfutbol]

Mar 20, 2011 14:06:10 GMT -6 PantherU said:

Mar 20, 2011 13:37:15 GMT -6 uwmfutbol said:

Nevertheless, above all else I believe what is hampering this program is the lack of interest in the sports, the academics and research, and the University's growth in general. When those associated with the school couldn't care less about what happens there, nothing changes.

And why do the people at school not care? Wouldn't the success of the "big brother" be a big reason? Didn't you just say yourself that you hate students who only have eyes for UW or MU?

You're making an assumption that all students at UWM don't care about UWM because it isn't Madison. When I was at UWM I knew people who were moderate Badger fans but couldn't care less about Madison as an institution. I don't think there's that deep of an inferiority complex on UWM's campus. That was never my point. My point is that UWM seems to attract a lot of students who have an apathetic viewpoint towards their school in general, and this happens for a variety of reasons. Conversely, a lot of people associated with UW-Madison see value in their school. My question is why this apathy exists in the first place. This goes much deeper than athletics.

[GoPanthers33]

Mar 20, 2011 14:07:04 GMT -6 PantherU said:

Mar 20, 2011 13:42:55 GMT -6 GoPanthers33 said:

I just don't think we are in a fight for name recognition. Do we fight for recruits yes but lets see:

NCAA appearances in last decade?

Green Bay- 0
Milwaukee- 3

I think we are above them as a program due to more recent success. Did I say I root for them greatly? No. But in the non-con I will as it makes the state look good and makes the Horizon league look good as well.

Try to rip on my Panther pride all you want but all that matters to me is what I know and feel with my team.

I'm not ripping your Panther Pride, I'm saying that you should realize how a successful GB program is a deterrent to your own.

I would hope thats the case cause using phrases like "A die hard black and gold should realize" and saying "I'm more f'd up than the others" just sounds like an attack to me.

And also just because I pull for other programs does not mean I have the fallback mentality you mentioned. When we lost to Butler I did not think to myself "O well I still have MU and UW in the tourney"

Instead I went the whole night without sleep and barely said a word to anyone for the next 2 days... I wanted to see us in the tourney as a student more than anything in the world and that might be the closest I'll ever come. Hopefully I'll get another chance in the next couple seasons.

[PantherU]

Mar 20, 2011 13:59:08 GMT -6 buppie05 said:

Mar 20, 2011 13:29:39 GMT -6 PantherU said:

A die hard black and gold panther should realize that any victory for Green Bay is a defeat for our program because we fight for recognition, and more importantly recruits, at every turn.

futbol, you may be right in that it would be the final step and not the first, but it's still a step that absolutely must be taken.

+1

Just as Josh Gasser would look good in a panther uniform. You can't tell me Gasser wasn't on our radar, or that it wasn't a realistic possibility that he could come here. Do you think if Wisconsin gets knocked out by Butler that even 1% of their fans will say, "well at least we still have in state team in the field, go Marquette!". No and they shouldn't. Not unless they have no problem with the Wes Matthews and Vander Blue of the world leaving town to go to MU.

We were Gasser's second choice. We had an offer on him for years, with tepid interest from Madison. When Madison all of a sudden got hot and offered him during his senior year, he took the scholarship offer from them. We had been in on him since before his voice broke, but as soon as he got the offer from Wisconsin,

Of course, some people on here believe that if you have an offer from Wisconsin, you're crap for not taking it a la JP Tokoto. Here's the quote:

When you are raised a Badger and you get a chance to play for UW then you should go to UW.

So, if Josh Gasser had taken our offer instead of Wisconsin's, he would have been in the wrong?

Come on, people. Get with the program! This is who we are, and this crap needs to CHANGE, NOW.

[buppie05]

Mar 20, 2011 13:56:56 GMT -6 uwmfutbol said:

Mar 20, 2011 13:47:40 GMT -6 buppie05 said:

If you are pulling for an outcome that directly hurts the panthers, then please go **** yourself. Thats my opinion.

You're entitled to your opinion, but this accomplishes nothing.

I understand your stand on this, but I respectfully disagree. Perception is more powerful in a lot of cases than reality, and the perception of Milwaukee outside the fan base is that we are a nice little school that tries hard, but not a serious program to lose sleep over. Certainly nobody will be "taking a bullet" for Milwaukee anytime soon.

I agree the last thing we need is to alienate people to Milwaukee. If someone attends a panthers game with a Bucky shirt on we shouldn't chastise them, but rather thank them for their curiosity in the program. (unless we are playing Wisconsin)

UWM futbol, I follow Milwaukee soccer as well. Would you root for Wisconsin soccer in the NCAA tournament if Milwaukee just missed the field? probably not right? Because we compete with them yearly, beat them often, and offer a lot of the same players right? Well what came first the chicken or the egg? thats all I'm saying.

[mcdadenets50]

Gasser was inches away from signing with NU. He was waiting for UW to offer. But this is recruiting so who gives a crap who finished second.

[PantherU]

Mar 20, 2011 14:12:54 GMT -6 uwmfutbol said:

Conversely, a lot of people associated with UW-Madison see value in their school. My question is why this apathy exists in the first place. This goes much deeper than athletics.

Maybe it's because the campus is full of students that cheer for Madison, alumni that cheer for Madison, and a city that cares mostly for Madison.

And Jerm, I'm sorry if you took what I said as much - when I said that's f'd up, I was referring to what you said, not who you are.

We all remember (at least those of us with good memories do) when you came on this board as a junior in high school. I'm not questioning your pride, just the reasoning that GB success doesn't hurt us.

[GoPanthers33]

Mar 20, 2011 14:18:06 GMT -6 PantherU said:

And Jerm, I'm sorry if you took what I said as much - when I said that's f'd up, I was referring to what you said, not who you are.

We all remember (at least those of us with good memories do) when you came on this board as a junior in high school. I'm not questioning your pride, just the reasoning that GB success doesn't hurt us.

I think Green bay's success can also help us though. If they are good in the non-conference then the HL looks better. If I could have it my way I would want the entire Horizon League to go 12-0 in non-conference even though I hate some of the teams.

They are a distant 4th on my list of teams but as I said before if I want anyone to finish 2nd in the HL behind Milwaukee I'll take GB and in that case we would still get better recognition from recruits as we would be conference champions.

[uwmfutbol]

"UWM futbol I follow Milwaukee soccer as well. Would you root for Wisconsin soccer in the NCAA tournament if Milwaukee just missed the field? probably not right? Because we compete with them yearly, beat them often, and offer a lot of the same players right? Well what came first the chicken or the egg? thats all I'm saying."

Actually I do pull for Wisconsin soccer as long as they're not playing UWM. They have a very solid, respectable program. They've been pretty terrible lately, though. You would've been better off using Marquette soccer as an example--I can't stand them and I hate everything about them. However, if soccer held the same weight as basketball, I likely would still root for them when they weren't playing UW or UWM.

Coming back to basketball, even though I hated Marquette basketball when they had players like Travis Diener and Dominique James, I still will acknowledge that their success is overall a good thing for Milwaukee. Rather than see Marquette and UW-Madison's downfall, I'd rather see UWM rise to that level, and I don't think that having fans support all of these teams is the problem. Given UWM's alumni and student base, you'd think it would be easy to get 7,000 fans at the Cell. With numbers like that, it'd be much easier to facilitate the process of building an on-campus arena. These are the baby steps necessary towards raising the profile of the program.

I think you're 100% right about the casual fans who primarily follow Wisconsin basketball: thank them for the curiosity in the program and encourage them to check out more games. I still maintain that UWM games are the best deal in town. You're always going to run into Badger fans who are arrogant and wouldn't hesitate to trash anything that's not UW-Madison. This fan says **** them. Every program has moronic fans.

[PANTHERfan]

Buppie brought up a fine point that I neglected to consider --- revenue. A Butler win is a financial boon for the Conference. That alone should settle any debate.

A Wisconsin win does absolutely nothing for the Milwaukee program. Neither recruits nor fans will look at Milwaukee any differently if Bucky wins. But people that rip the Horizon (ie, people that know absolutely nothing about college basketball) will have to look at the conference with respect if Butler wins.

In the end, I couldn't care less who people are rooting for in their hearts. But looking at this solely through the lens of "what's best for Milwaukee", it's pretty clear than a Butler win matters most.

And lastly, I don't doubt or question anyone's Panther Pride that's taking the time to comment on this board. Clearly, we all care deeply.

[uwmfutbol]

Mar 20, 2011 14:18:06 GMT -6 PantherU said:

Mar 20, 2011 14:12:54 GMT -6 uwmfutbol said:

Conversely, a lot of people associated with UW-Madison see value in their school. My question is why this apathy exists in the first place. This goes much deeper than athletics.

Maybe it's because the campus is full of students that cheer for Madison, alumni that cheer for Madison, and a city that cares mostly for Madison.

And Jerm, I'm sorry if you took what I said as much - when I said that's f'd up, I was referring to what you said, not who you are.

We all remember (at least those of us with good memories do) when you came on this board as a junior in high school. I'm not questioning your pride, just the reasoning that GB success doesn't hurt us.

We're going in circles. Perhaps down the road UWM will have elevated its program to the point in which it's taboo to root for other programs, but that time certainly is not now. I still maintain that the apathetic attitude on UWM's campus runs much deeper than athletics, and that's where I would start (I think finishing off the commuter school image is a must). I know people that went to UW-La Crosse and UW-Oshkosh and wouldn't have ever transferred to Madison. Why is UWM different?

In the end, I guess I'm the minority because I like rooting for multiple teams, just like most of my family members. My father-in-law has no connection to UWGB, yet he attends various men's and women's games. Why? Because it's fun and it's good for Green Bay when they're doing well. He was rooting for UWM in the NIT, and is now rooting for Wisconsin and Marquette in the NCAAs.

I don't think I have much more to say on this topic, but keep in mind that we should certainly not be questioning whether or not ANYONE on this board is truly a fan or not.