Rawls
Junior
Everyone's Entitled To My Opinion
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Post by Rawls on Nov 28, 2010 22:52:38 GMT -6
I'm going to take Fran's advice after this post. 16 home games to be profitable, maybe less now, but lets say 16. Never mind the fact that you play in one of the larger arenas in college basketball, and (to your credit) put out top attendance numbers, but still 'need' two to three times as many home games non-conference, plus the dough from the annual preseason tournament just to break even. But okay 16 it is.
2010-11: 19 home games
2009-10: 18
2008-09: 19
2007-08: 18
2006-07: 22
You can afford to play across the street every three years even using that math.
So now I take Fran's advice and turn my attention to the Horizon League. Good luck to Marquette. As I said in a different thread, the loud minority do not represent that institution, most of the fans were class acts last night. I'm done.
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Post by hueyp on Nov 28, 2010 22:54:01 GMT -6
Bo Ryan has far more of a vested interest in our program at this point than Buzz Williams does. Wisconsin always gave us respect. I Like Ryan as a coach and I think he did a great job during his time in Milwaukee but I need to pint out that under Dick Bennett, Wisconsin played home-and-home series with both UWGB and Milwaukee (Including a fantastsic game at Klotsche), because Bennett believed it was the right thing to do. As soon as Ryan got the job, we got hosed, schedule-wise. Coincidence? No. If Bo wanted to play the other state schools home and home every year he could. Bennett did. Considering the fact that Ryan used Milwaukee as a stepping stone to the Madison job and his former top assistant now coaches here, I would say he has a funny way of "giving us respect." |
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Post by Super King on Nov 28, 2010 23:10:43 GMT -6
Bo Ryan has continuously lobbied hard for the four-team inter-state rivalry games, however, far more than Marquette has (this is their first year playing UWGB since the 90s, after all, and it occurred in an early-season tournament). I wouldn't be surprised if the 3-1 (or is it 4-1? I can never remember) has less to do with Ryan than it does with the athletic department at large. It is about money, after all. And no major conference teams schedule home-and-homes with potential upset-minded mid-major teams. Wisconsin isn't any different.
Comparing anyone with Dick Bennett is an immediate apples-to-oranges scenario anyway.
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Post by xtownfan on Nov 28, 2010 23:44:08 GMT -6
xtown - Please tell us why you have vested interest in the financial situation. If there is such limited interest in this game for MU fans, the revenue difference between ticket sales for a home game and the payment for an away game cannot be significant. And, please, limit your response to two or fewer paragraphs. To our friend above, why am I referring to a game from three years ago? Because it was part of the current five-year deal. The argument was made that playing UWM is much better than playing a no-return game against a bad buy team. The point is, most years, you ARE a bad buy team. Since returning to D-1, the teams have played nine or ten times. One has been competitive. The rest have been blow-outs. So don't diss the bad teams Marquette plays in no-return games. Most years, that's you. If past history is any guide, if we sign another five-year deal, UWM will suck for four of them. As for the income disparity, do the math yourself. UWM is getting $40,000 a game for the games at Marquette. Marquette got nothing for last night's game. Those details were published and somebody put a link to the actual contract on this board. You will recall that when this deal was singed, Bud Haidet held it up demanding an extra $20.000. Now, let's look at a game against another opponent. Figure 14,000 tickets at $25 each. That's probably low, but figure that. Now, I don't know what Marquette has to pay to get the Bradley Center, but let's aim high and say it costs $100,000 to put on the game. Now figure Marquette pays the visiting team $40,000. That leaves a profit of $210,000 a game. So we have the choice of making a couple hundred grand or making nothing. That's not much of an income disparity, is it? I do not have inside information. These figures are guesses. But they are in the ballpark. There is no question, Marquette makes a lot of money hosting games. UWM, OTOH, almost has to be losing money on them. So when you suggest that Marquette can afford to give up a home game, you are being generous with someone else's money. If the powers that be at Marquette decide that it makes sense to sign a two or three or four for one deal, I will leave it to them. But why do I care? Because I support the Marquette program and that money makes it possible to play in the Big East, to hire quality coaches, to provide excellent facilities, to recruit the whole country, to fly the team on charters, to do all that stuff. I want my team to be successful and be able to do that. I am not all that concerned if someone else's team can. |
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Post by lashmo on Nov 29, 2010 1:05:18 GMT -6
How about we get down to the real deal. Can you imagine the mighty golden eagles losing to lowly UWM panthers? Well without a combined first half of 70+% shooting there would've been a hell of a hangover for the program on Sunday morning. You see you can throw numbers around all you want but the bottom line is recruiting. If Marquette shot the way they did vs. Gonzaga (combined 33%) or Duke (32%) they would have had much explaining to do the the future prospects. You see it would be not just a loss but a devastating loss. The "big" named programs protect their future. That is why they schedule the bottom feeders. If it was about money they would play all "big" named schools during the non-conference. It's about wins and then conference. If Marquette loses to Duke so what but UWM? DEVASTATION! That was almost a reality Saturday. Toooo close for comfort. A win gives them just a win but a loss is a killer. Too much for such a risk-averse program. Now the bad news for Marquette--- parity. There are thousands upon thousands more kids starting the sport shortly after nursing stops. Don't pre-schoolers now have AAU traveling teams? There are only so many D-1 scholarships available. The talent pool has grown my friend. It really is simple. I guess you could call it afraid of a possible loss and yes THEN the pockets would truly suffer. If you don't want to have a 1 and 1 or even a 2-1 I wouldn't blame you a bit. A famous drill sergeant once said....."YOU KNOW WHAT MAKES ME SAD? YOU DO!! MAYBE WE SHOULD GO ON OVER TO MAMBY-PAMBY LAND AND SEE IF WE CAN FIND YOU SOME SELF-CONFIDENCE!! YA JACKWAGON!!!
With that being said Mr. X why don't you take your B-S makeshift figures coupled with your political explanation and go back to your eagles nest and hide and hope that your program doesn't run into another lowly program like UWM when you have one of your average shooting nights. A three point win? Really?
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Post by buppie05 on Nov 29, 2010 1:27:38 GMT -6
Why do you MU fans say we are a bad team most years? Looking over the last ten years we've been good the majority of them, save rebuilding years with a first time head coach learning on the fly.
This would be another perfect time for Marquette to not renew the serious, when we have a lot of good young talent, and 2 of the best recruits in Panther history coming in next year. Shaq Boga is probably our most coveted recruit ever.
I don't think it will happen again. Both institutions are beacons for the community, and in the end I think this game will have much larger implications than just revenue and RPI. This series needs to continue, and it would be a travesty if we had another situation like we had from 2000-2006, 2 NCAA Tournament caliber teams in the same city that don't play each other.
Oh and about Bo Ryan, whoever thinks that Bo has ever given a sh*t about the University of Wisconsin Milwaukee or Panther Athletics really is sipping the Kool-aid. The guy just looks like a snake. Dick Bennett giving us a 1-1 was maybe because he thought it was the right thing to do, or because every other year he could showcase his team to fans and potential recruits living in this particular recruiting hotbed.
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Post by muwarrior2007 on Nov 29, 2010 1:42:50 GMT -6
Why do you MU fans say we are a bad team most years? Looking over the last ten years we've been good the majority of them, save rebuilding years with a first time head coach learning on the fly. This would be another perfect time for Marquette to not renew the serious, when we have a lot of good young talent, and 2 of the best recruits in Panther history coming in next year. Shaq Boga is probably our most coveted recruit ever. I don't think it will happen again. Both institutions are beacons for the community, and in the end I think this game will have much larger implications than just revenue and RPI. This series needs to continue, and it would be a travesty if we had another situation like we had from 2000-2006, 2 NCAA Tournament caliber teams in the same city that don't play each other. Oh and about Bo Ryan, whoever thinks that Bo has ever given a sh*t about the University of Wisconsin Milwaukee or Panther Athletics really is sipping the Kool-aid. The guy just looks like a snake. Dick Bennett giving us a 1-1 was maybe because he thought it was the right thing to do, or because every other year he could showcase his team to fans and potential recruits living in this particular recruiting hotbed. First of all, great game last night. For the most part your fans were very nice (outside of the 50 or so students who felt the need to flip off some of the MU fan sections during the "Hey Song" midway through the second half). I enjoyed going to the game, and seeing the old Arena. I was disappointed in the lack of significant MU fan turn-out, but that'll happen. I would love to see the series continue, but not at a 2 for 1. Mostly because UWM has not shown it's value to deserve that kind of deal. It feels like we (MU fans and the Milwaukee community) were sold a bill of goods. See e.g. "This game will sell out every year," "it's good for basketball in the state of Wisconsin," "this is a rivalry that needs to be played." This game has not generated the interest that UWM fans and the local media claimed that it would (none of the games have been sell-outs, and the games at MU have barely generated more attendance than most of our buy games). If it comes down to a 2 for 1, I hope MU does not renew the contract, and instead tries to get a game (even if it's a home and home) with Creighton, SLU or Dayton. All traditional opponents, with more of a connection to MU than UW-Milwaukee. 3 for 1, maybe. 4 for 1 or 5 for 1? Definitely. (I believe 4 for 1 is the current deal, and I'd be all for renewing that). But not a 2 for 1. BTW, as for the scheduling complaints, we have UW, at Vandy, and the preseason tourney this year. Next year we have at UW, Vandy, and at LSU. So, there's really no merit to any of those comments. |
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Post by xtownfan on Nov 29, 2010 2:14:10 GMT -6
Why do you MU fans say we are a bad team most years? Looking over the last ten years we've been good the majority of them, save rebuilding years with a first time head coach learning on the fly. This would be another perfect time for Marquette to not renew the serious, when we have a lot of good young talent, and 2 of the best recruits in Panther history coming in next year. Shaq Boga is probably our most coveted recruit ever. I don't think it will happen again. Both institutions are beacons for the community, and in the end I think this game will have much larger implications than just revenue and RPI. This series needs to continue, and it would be a travesty if we had another situation like we had from 2000-2006, 2 NCAA Tournament caliber teams in the same city that don't play each other. Oh and about Bo Ryan, whoever thinks that Bo has ever given a sh*t about the University of Wisconsin Milwaukee or Panther Athletics really is sipping the Kool-aid. The guy just looks like a snake. Dick Bennett giving us a 1-1 was maybe because he thought it was the right thing to do, or because every other year he could showcase his team to fans and potential recruits living in this particular recruiting hotbed. Sorry, but that is what the records say. Last year: 20 pt. loss, but to be fair, it was a better game than that. Year before, when you were good enough to beat Butler? 20 pt. loss that wasn't that close. Most of the time? Not very competitive. Are these better games than Prairie View and Savannah State? Sure, at least sometimes. That is why all things being equal, I would just as soon see us play you. But most mid-majors are going to go through cycles. When you've played us, you've been down. On the other hand, some of those other buy teams have been pretty good. Some years back, Winthrop won at our place and made the tournament. It wasn't so devastating. Marquette did too, and recruiting continued just fine. Marquette could surely survive a loss to UWM. We're not competing for the same players. So you are building a great team? Glad to hear it. But I have heard it before. You had that transfer from Okla. St. who was supposed to be an NBA talent. You had two kids from Chicago from a state championship team. The team actually improved when Jeter got rid of them. If you succeed, you'll be in a better position. It would help if your coach is not a slimeball, like the last guy who got you to the tournament. This isn't an accusation. I have heard nothing but good about Jeter. Perhaps the fact that he hasn't been able to build an instant winner proves it. I do not doubt that Rob could be more successful if he was as free-wheeling with the rules as his predecessor. No doubt he is much better liked by the Marquette athletic department. And since the people involved seem to be able to tolerate each other, my guess is that the deal will get done. And it won't be negotiated in the sports pages and radio talk shows, and it will be done on terms everybody can live with. But my guess is that means a 3-1 deal or the like. |
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Post by PantherU on Nov 29, 2010 9:48:35 GMT -6
Wow. Go to work, sleep, and wake up to three more pages and what...20,000 words?
I'll pass. Look, guys, there's no point in bringing the same arguments back. No matter what side of this you're on, your mind isn't going to be changed by someone on the other side.
Let's just all step back and breathe.
Edit: I will say this to the MU-UWM argument: the first three years of this series, the Milwaukee Panthers were the highest-rated RPI opponent to play at the Bradley Center in the non-conference season, save for two games against Wisconsin and one game against NC State.
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Post by PantherU on Nov 29, 2010 9:53:52 GMT -6
Bo Ryan has continuously lobbied hard for the four-team inter-state rivalry games, however, far more than Marquette has (this is their first year playing UWGB since the 90s, after all, and it occurred in an early-season tournament). I wouldn't be surprised if the 3-1 (or is it 4-1? I can never remember) has less to do with Ryan than it does with the athletic department at large. It is about money, after all. And no major conference teams schedule home-and-homes with potential upset-minded mid-major teams. Wisconsin isn't any different. Comparing anyone with Dick Bennett is an immediate apples-to-oranges scenario anyway. Don't be ridiculous, that 7-for-2 had EVERYTHING to do with Bo. I like Bo. He's a great guy, he donates annually to our program, he's got a vested interest here. However, I can say with 100% certainty that I know how the negotiations went, because I talked to people on our side of it. When Bo was here, he told our people he'd continue the home-and-home series; when he got to UW and the time came to renew, he was not so forthcoming. That 7-2 was, how should we say...a compromise between what Bud had and what Bo had. And it was quite close to being in the middle. |
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Post by JG Panthers on Nov 29, 2010 11:21:13 GMT -6
For a game that Marquette fans claim ISN'T a rivalry, they sure seem to care alot about it. Seems crazy that someone would come on this board simply to assert their dominance and try to explain why we're nothing. I mean, don't these people have anything better to do than to try and tell us why we're worthless and why they're the center of the universe. Please...I have so many more things to concern myself with than Marquette elitists. I've never taken kindly to bullies, and I don't expect to anytime soon. Take a hike Marquette losers...
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Post by Pounce Needs Pals on Nov 29, 2010 11:35:03 GMT -6
Just cause some MU people come on here is NOT the voice of Marquette or 98% of it's season ticket holders.
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Post by JG Panthers on Nov 29, 2010 12:42:15 GMT -6
Just cause some MU people come on here is NOT the voice of Marquette or 98% of it's season ticket holders. I appreciate you mupanther, but the strong personalities and obnoxious arrogance by 98% of the MU fans that come HERE to "contribute" feed my disdain for everything Marquette. My distaste for their pompous attitude is in no way directed towards you. |
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Post by duck on Nov 29, 2010 14:04:43 GMT -6
Just cause some MU people come on here is NOT the voice of Marquette or 98% of it's season ticket holders. I appreciate you mupanther, but the strong personalities and obnoxious arrogance by 98% of the MU fans that come HERE to "contribute" feed my disdain for everything Marquette. My distaste for their pompous attitude is in no way directed towards you. Most MU fans respect UWM fans. Unfortunately, the reality on many issues regarding this series is something you guys don't want to hear. We're just telling you like it is. The promises of sellouts was nonsense, and we stated that years ago yet people here and in the media insisted it would happen. It didn't. Of course it didn't. Hate to say we told you, but we told you. Why should MU extend a 2 for 1 to UWM? Why? Because it's good for the state of basketball? BS. It's good for UWM. Let's not forget the obnoxious arrogance of some UWM fans (one in particular who is also a Wisconsin fan) that has rubbed MU fans the wrong way for a decade. We can read, too. Best of luck the rest of the season. I'm glad Jeter replaced the cheater (Pearl). Class act. |
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Post by Hack on Nov 29, 2010 14:11:07 GMT -6
I'm glad Jeter replaced the cheater (Pearl). Class act. And we're glad Buzz replaced the douchebag. |
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