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Post by ricestillfumbled on Apr 26, 2017 15:45:08 GMT -6
Make this happen!!!! I'd miss Green Bay but pros obviously outweigh the cons here!
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Post by mrpantherfan on Apr 26, 2017 18:53:34 GMT -6
The Valley is a dumpster fire. They think they are still good but without Creighton and the Shockers they are nobody. UNI is not going to carry any league. They are done. They need Valpo or Murray St to save their league. And, if they are dumb enough to go then the Horizon is done. The Horizon has been a better league for talent top to bottom, except for the Shockers. I do know both leagues very well and have watched for many years.
The smart move is to merge leagues and make an east-west division. This solves scheduling and it becomes the premier mid major league. After all the complaining on this site over schedules, this is the solution and it's an obvious one. Travel could be reduced with bus rides for quite a few games. The footprint would allow for a better tv contract in the major midwest cities. The Valley has few major cities, that's why they needed Loyola when Creighton left.
Everyone in Valley country knows this league is done. They need major name teams. Don't be so quick to say this is better. It's not. Unless teams jump ship like VALPO. Then we suck. Merge and make it better for both.
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Post by parkerj on Apr 26, 2017 23:33:08 GMT -6
The Valley is a dumpster fire. They think they are still good but without Creighton and the Shockers they are nobody. UNI is not going to carry any league. They are done. They need Valpo or Murray St to save their league. And, if they are dumb enough to go then the Horizon is done. The Horizon has been a better league for talent top to bottom, except for the Shockers. I do know both leagues very well and have watched for many years. The smart move is to merge leagues and make an east-west division. This solves scheduling and it becomes the premier mid major league. After all the complaining on this site over schedules, this is the solution and it's an obvious one. Travel could be reduced with bus rides for quite a few games. The footprint would allow for a better tv contract in the major midwest cities. The Valley has few major cities, that's why they needed Loyola when Creighton left. Everyone in Valley country knows this league is done. They need major name teams. Don't be so quick to say this is better. It's not. Unless teams jump ship like VALPO. Then we suck. Merge and make it better for both. Huh? Look at Wichita's history before Gregg Marshall...Turgeon got 1 Sweet Sixteen and 3 NIT bids...before that, their last NCAA Tournament was in the 80s. UNI's resume absolutely dwarfs that (hell...both Jacobson AND McDermott have better resumes at UNI than that). Obviously no Koch Bro $, but I don't think there's any doubt that they'd be able to rise up and take over in a pretty similar fashion to how WSU did after Creighton left (with Illinois State poised to become the second quality squad). The conference might fall back, but it'd still be head-and-shoulders better than the HL, particularly if Valpo & Murray joined.
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Post by mrpantherfan on Apr 27, 2017 8:06:23 GMT -6
If, and that's a big if, both Murray St and Valpo join the MVC it will be better than the Horizon. But I've followed UNI for decades. (I did love to see our Panthers pound them in Milwaukee and Tiby glare down Jacobson). But UNI is not getting the recruits they once did and have missed on some top recruits that have not panned out. They are trending downward. So much so many think Jacobson will be leaving soon because he will never duplicate his past successes. UNI had a long losing streak in the league last year, which never happened before.
My original idea is to merge both leagues into two divisions. That's a win for both struggling leagues.
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Post by JG Panthers on Apr 27, 2017 8:40:47 GMT -6
My original idea is to merge both leagues into two divisions. That's a win for both struggling leagues. This would be cool, it just won't happen.
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Post by commissioner on Apr 27, 2017 21:47:41 GMT -6
The Valley is a dumpster fire. They think they are still good but without Creighton and the Shockers they are nobody. UNI is not going to carry any league. They are done. They need Valpo or Murray St to save their league. And, if they are dumb enough to go then the Horizon is done. The Horizon has been a better league for talent top to bottom, except for the Shockers. I do know both leagues very well and have watched for many years. The smart move is to merge leagues and make an east-west division. This solves scheduling and it becomes the premier mid major league. After all the complaining on this site over schedules, this is the solution and it's an obvious one. Travel could be reduced with bus rides for quite a few games. The footprint would allow for a better tv contract in the major midwest cities. The Valley has few major cities, that's why they needed Loyola when Creighton left. Everyone in Valley country knows this league is done. They need major name teams. Don't be so quick to say this is better. It's not. Unless teams jump ship like VALPO. Then we suck. Merge and make it better for both. Based on last season's results, the Wichita Stateless MVC, with Murray State added in place of the Shockers, would have almost the exact same Conference RPI as the Horizon. If Milwaukee goes, the Horizon would have a better RPI. Only if Valpo switches to the MVC would the MVC retain an edge in Conference RPI.
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Post by parkerj on Apr 28, 2017 0:22:05 GMT -6
The Valley is a dumpster fire. They think they are still good but without Creighton and the Shockers they are nobody. UNI is not going to carry any league. They are done. They need Valpo or Murray St to save their league. And, if they are dumb enough to go then the Horizon is done. The Horizon has been a better league for talent top to bottom, except for the Shockers. I do know both leagues very well and have watched for many years. The smart move is to merge leagues and make an east-west division. This solves scheduling and it becomes the premier mid major league. After all the complaining on this site over schedules, this is the solution and it's an obvious one. Travel could be reduced with bus rides for quite a few games. The footprint would allow for a better tv contract in the major midwest cities. The Valley has few major cities, that's why they needed Loyola when Creighton left. Everyone in Valley country knows this league is done. They need major name teams. Don't be so quick to say this is better. It's not. Unless teams jump ship like VALPO. Then we suck. Merge and make it better for both. Based on last season's results, the Wichita Stateless MVC, with Murray State added in place of the Shockers, would have almost the exact same Conference RPI as the Horizon. If Milwaukee goes, the Horizon would have a better RPI. Only if Valpo switches to the MVC would the MVC retain an edge in Conference RPI. Sure, but teams that bring back all but 1 starter and 1 other rotation player (Milwaukee) tend to improve. Assuming a team that's finished above .500 something like 21 of the last 22 seasons (Murray) will have another losing year also seems like a gamble, particularly when their bench guys got extra burn due to injured starters & they bring back an efficient 20 PPG scorer
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Post by Super King on Apr 28, 2017 0:32:03 GMT -6
We among all should be very aware that finishing above .500 in a mid-major conference means almost nothing. It is about making and/or winning games in the NCAA Tournament. Period.
Also, it is a sure bet that if Valpo is accepted into the MVC, then UWM will not be; so factoring Valpo's presence into the MVC's prestige as an attractive force is silly.
Conference realignment -- beginning back when the Big East raided CUSA -- has killed mid-major college basketball, and we are currently among the victims. Our best hope was, is, and will continue to be continued success over 5-10 years and the hope that one of the higher-level CUSA/AAC type conferences takes notice. Other than, of course, the collapse and restructuring of the NCAA -- a pipe dream, but one can only hope.
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Post by parkerj on Apr 28, 2017 0:55:13 GMT -6
We among all should be very aware that finishing above .500 in a mid-major conference means almost nothing. It is about making and/or winning games in the NCAA Tournament. Period. In a given year? Sure. Over the course of 2 decades? I completely disagree. Ehh? Word is the MVC wants to keep its public/private ratio the same. Adding Valpo arguably helps us if that turns out to be the case. It likely means Murray is in too and they could move to 12 teams. ...the CUSA? Despite MTSU's tournament success, the CUSA is shifting toward being a southern football conference and it's definitely hurting the basketball side of things. The few metrics I can find rank the MVC decidedly higher than the CUSA, to the point that WSU leaving wouldn't change things. Hell, we're higher than the CUSA in Conference RPI.
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Post by Super King on Apr 28, 2017 0:57:54 GMT -6
And considering that Memphis was in Conference USA when they made their championship game appearance, it is all the more damning that the conference would have fallen -- thanks to realignment. Football, of course, is the huge elephant in the room, but long-term losing football will be seen as such a money-saver that I don't think, among mid-majors, that it will be a deal-killer for basketball schools.
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Post by parkerj on Apr 28, 2017 1:02:40 GMT -6
And considering that Memphis was in Conference USA when they made their championship game appearance, it is all the more damning that the conference would have fallen -- thanks to realignment. Football, of course, is the huge elephant in the room, but long-term losing football will be seen as such a money-saver that I don't think, among mid-majors, that it will be a deal-killer for basketball schools. Right...so aligning ourselves with a conference that'll gladly let its football sister-conference take on the YSU's of the world without diluting its product in basketball seems like a good move if we can swing it.
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Post by PantherU on Apr 28, 2017 15:59:21 GMT -6
Link: MVC is done with visits; choosing new members from the fourValparaiso, Murray State, Omaha and Milwaukee. Those are the four schools that are up for three spots in the MVC. All the visits are done. MSU was Monday, VU Tuesday, Omaha Wednesday and Milwaukee on Thursday. They checked out Panther Arena at 9 am yesterday. MVC meeting is set for next weekend.
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Post by Pantherholic on Apr 28, 2017 17:46:26 GMT -6
Link: MVC is done with visits; choosing new members from the fourValparaiso, Murray State, Omaha and Milwaukee. Those are the four schools that are up for three spots in the MVC. All the visits are done. MSU was Monday, VU Tuesday, Omaha Wednesday and Milwaukee on Thursday. They checked out Panther Arena at 9 am yesterday. MVC meeting is set for next weekend. The Valley is officially going to 12?
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Post by mcdadenets50 on Apr 28, 2017 17:53:24 GMT -6
Link: MVC is done with visits; choosing new members from the fourValparaiso, Murray State, Omaha and Milwaukee. Those are the four schools that are up for three spots in the MVC. All the visits are done. MSU was Monday, VU Tuesday, Omaha Wednesday and Milwaukee on Thursday. They checked out Panther Arena at 9 am yesterday. MVC meeting is set for next weekend. Wow, scary that this could happen. We have to be a better option than Omaha. Why do I see us coming in fourth?
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Post by parkerj on Apr 28, 2017 18:50:44 GMT -6
Link: MVC is done with visits; choosing new members from the fourValparaiso, Murray State, Omaha and Milwaukee. Those are the four schools that are up for three spots in the MVC. All the visits are done. MSU was Monday, VU Tuesday, Omaha Wednesday and Milwaukee on Thursday. They checked out Panther Arena at 9 am yesterday. MVC meeting is set for next weekend. Wow, scary that this could happen. We have to be a better option than Omaha. Why do I see us coming in fourth? For some reason, I have that feeling too...and it makes no sense to me.
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