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Post by illwauk on Aug 1, 2012 22:55:01 GMT -6
I'd only support a change to Wisconsin State if it meant a return to the Green Gulls identity, but University of Milwaukee is just more practical and more fitting, seeing as how we're an urban research institution and it would cost a whole hell of a lot less to just drop "of Wisconsin-" from our name than to adopt an entirely new name. Although I'd still rather we be the Gulls than the Panthers. Anyone whose ever visited our campus around the time when the students return in the fall should be able to figure out why that is.
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Lutzow10
Freshman
MILWAUKEE PROUD - PANTHER STRONG
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Post by Lutzow10 on Aug 1, 2012 23:33:23 GMT -6
Everyone on here agrees that the W needs to go. That means that a good amount of people not on here think that way too. There has to be a way to make it happen. I vote we start the "DROP THE DUB" campaign. Haha. But seriously, it gets annoying telling people u go to UWM and they say 'oh so ur a badger' or ' madison is such a nice school'
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Post by skrapheap on Aug 2, 2012 7:20:50 GMT -6
Not everyone agrees that the W must go.
I graduated from the University of Wisconsin-Madison, who markets its athletics program as the Wisconsin Badgers.
i prefer that the Athletic Department at UW-Milwaukee decide that marketing its programs as the Milwaukee Panthers be a priority and that they insist that news media use that name, and that the Bookstore stop freelancing on Panther gear, to begin with.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2012 7:55:04 GMT -6
Its good that dropping the W is kept in this day dreaming conversation about football.
No, we're not all for dropping the W. Hardly. On my resume, I want the connection to the UW system. However, I am completely in support of continuing to brand the athletic department as the Milwaukee Panthers.
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Post by illwauk on Aug 2, 2012 14:32:23 GMT -6
Its good that dropping the W is kept in this day dreaming conversation about football. No, we're not all for dropping the W. Hardly. On my resume, I want the connection to the UW system. However, I am completely in support of continuing to brand the athletic department as the Milwaukee Panthers. Is there, like, an unwritten rule that says those who aren't in favor of football or are too cynical to imagine it reinstated have to be douches to those of us who want to see it return? Anyway, there's an easy solution to the naming problem. Plenty of schools brand themselves differently than their official name. I've brought up Virginia Polytechnical Institution & State University a number of times. If you haven't heard of it, it's probably because you know it as Virginia Tech... ...and that's essentially what we should do. Keep the "University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee" name on paper for legal purposes, but replace all the signage, logos and letterheads that refer to "Wisconsin-" or UWM with stuff that says "University of Milwaukee" or "U of M." That way, people who want the University of Wisconsin connection can still put it on their resume (thought I'm not sure why, since the UW name really isn't as prestigious as the boosters in Madison make it out to be), and those of us who don't feel like spending five minutes explaining the naming convention for Wisconsin universities everytime we're mistaken for a Badger can put "University of Milwaukee."
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Post by illwauk on Aug 3, 2012 0:09:41 GMT -6
For those who care, I've tweaked the uniforms and turned the alt helmet/alt home/alt pants combo into a throwback that the Panthers wore in their final game against Whitewater in 1974.
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Post by skrapheap on Aug 3, 2012 8:43:16 GMT -6
Is there, like, an unwritten rule that says those who aren't in favor of football or are too cynical to imagine it reinstated have to be douches to those of us who want to see it return? No, but there's an unwritten rule that somebody on the board has to be a realist. There are so many on this board who are so enamored of the idea of a Panther football program, that they seem scarcely able to recognize that major obstacles have to be overcome to start one. And i don't see how pointing this out makes the realists on this subject "douches."i still haven't seen evidence that this kind of mistaking happens all that frequently. Yes, i've read the anecdotes on the board, but, as a wise person observed recently, the plural of anecdote is not data.
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Lutzow10
Freshman
MILWAUKEE PROUD - PANTHER STRONG
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Post by Lutzow10 on Aug 3, 2012 9:17:07 GMT -6
I live out of state and i have come to the conclusion that most people i talk to 1) hear uwm and think madison 2) are not super familiar with uw madison and only know it as the university of wisconsin, and when u tell them u go to uw-Milwaukee they think badgers/UW, 3) u say uwm and they have no idea where you are talking about.
This is just my own experience. I dont know about other out of staters or what in staters deal with. The other reason i am for dropping the W ( when i say that i dont mean completely dropping it just start going by university of Milwaukee and/or milwaukee a lot more.) because its wordy and doesn't flow well in my opinion. Saying it all out (university of wisconsin-milwaukee) is just a mouth full, saying uw-Milwaukee is okay i guess and has the least issues, and uwm is the one that confuses everyone that i talk to down here. I just feel that more simplicity in the name would help it stick in peoples brains.
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Post by skrapheap on Aug 3, 2012 11:11:05 GMT -6
. The other reason i am for dropping the W ( when i say that i dont mean completely dropping it just start going by university of Milwaukee and/or milwaukee a lot more.) because its wordy and doesn't flow well in my opinion. Saying it all out (university of wisconsin-milwaukee) is just a mouth full, saying uw-Milwaukee is okay i guess and has the least issues, and uwm is the one that confuses everyone that i talk to down here. I just feel that more simplicity in the name would help it stick in peoples brains. This is the thinking behind the switch to marketing UW-Milwaukee athletics as the "Milwaukee Panthers." The problem is that the Athletic Department, having started toward this change, hasn't really insisted on it.
The "geniuses" at the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel keep insisting on referring to "UW-Milwaukee" and "UWM." ImO, part of that is them being jerks, and part of it is the Athletic Department letting them get away with it. Apparently the Milwaukee Panther identify has not, so far, been high on the Department's agenda, and i think the Department has to push harder if they want the identity recognized.
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Post by illwauk on Aug 6, 2012 19:38:46 GMT -6
No, but there's an unwritten rule that somebody on the board has to be a realist. There are so many on this board who are so enamored of the idea of a Panther football program, that they seem scarcely able to recognize that major obstacles have to be overcome to start one. And i don't see how pointing this out makes the realists on this subject "douches."
Call it what you want, but statements like the underlined are indeed, douchey... from the implicit chest thumping at being more "realistic" than everyone else, to the implication that anyone whose thoughts don't line up with your own is somehow out of touch with reality. I can deal with people who don't think football can happen as long as they actually add something to the discussion, but that's rarely, if ever, the case here.
I can only imagine all the crap Bud Hadiet must've heard about how moving to Division 1 was a pie-in-the-sky fantasy that would never work, how UWM was "just a commuter school that doesn't care about sports," how Milwaukee was a dying city that couldn't support a major athletics program, and how SE Wisconsin already had Marquette and didn't want two D1 programs.
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Post by skrapheap on Aug 7, 2012 7:26:02 GMT -6
No, but there's an unwritten rule that somebody on the board has to be a realist. TCall it what you want, but statements like the underlined are indeed, douchey... from the implicit chest thumping at being more "realistic" than everyone else, to the implication that anyone whose thoughts don't line up with your own is somehow out of touch with reality. I can deal with people who don't think football can happen as long as they actually add something to the discussion, but that's rarely, if ever, the case here. The "unwritten rule" line, snark and all, came directly from your posting. If you don't like the phrase, don't use it.
The whole point of the "realists" is that football is and will remain a pipe dream unless and until the boatload or two of money required to start a program can be raised. You may not feel that raising the point adds anything to the discussion, but that assessment only proves the point.
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Post by uwmfutbol on Aug 7, 2012 13:13:41 GMT -6
"thought I'm not sure why, since the UW name really isn't as prestigious as the boosters in Madison make it out to be"
The Academic Ranking of World Universities is arguably the most followed international ranking system, and it has Madison at 19 in the world, ahead of schools like Michigan, Wash. U in St. Louis, Northwestern, Illinois, etc. I'd call that prestige and brand power. That said, I don't think that has any effect on UWM. The benefits of being associated with the system are secondary (shared resources, courses, etc.).
I have no problem with my alma mater being called the University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, but the Panther brand is broken because our own University can't decide what to call us. Call us the Milwaukee Panthers for athletics and be done with it.
And while we're on the topic of world rankings, UWM made the 401-500 portion of the ARWU Top 500 list. That's awesome.
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Post by illwauk on Aug 7, 2012 19:07:07 GMT -6
"thought I'm not sure why, since the UW name really isn't as prestigious as the boosters in Madison make it out to be" The Academic Ranking of World Universities is arguably the most followed international ranking system, and it has Madison at 19 in the world, ahead of schools like Michigan, Wash. U in St. Louis, Northwestern, Illinois, etc. I'd call that prestige and brand power. That said, I don't think that has any effect on UWM. The benefits of being associated with the system are secondary (shared resources, courses, etc.). I'm not denying that Madison is a good school... possibly even one of the better ones in the country, but I still think it's seriously overrated by its own administrators and boosters such as how it claims to be a "public ivy" with the implication that it's on the level of Harvard, Princeton, Columbia, etc. People who actually went to those schools look at Madison the way Madison looks at us. Besides, I'm proud of what I've accomplished at Milwaukee... I don't need or want any opportunities because someone thought I went to a different school. I have no problem with my alma mater being called the University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, but the Panther brand is broken because our own University can't decide what to call us. Call us the Milwaukee Panthers for athletics and be done with it. A lot of people (myself included) think one of the main reasons why Milwaukee Panthers hasn't fully caught on as a brand is because "Milwaukee" is used in conjunct with "UWM" and thus we're still referred to as "Wisconsin-Milwaukee" and "UW-Milwaukee." And while we're on the topic of world rankings, UWM made the 401-500 portion of the ARWU Top 500 list. That's awesome. Our film school is also one of the top 25 in the entire world... GO PANTHERS!
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Post by uwmfutbol on Aug 8, 2012 9:41:55 GMT -6
"but I still think it's seriously overrated by its own administrators and boosters such as how it claims to be a "public ivy"" To be fair, the school didn't come up with that. It's from a book by Howard and Matthew Greene from 2001 called "The Public Ivies: America's Flagship Public Universities" (and it's notable to mention that they are both alumni of Ivies and one is a former admissions officer at Princeton). They list 30 or so flagship public universities that they deem offer a comparable education to that of the traditional Ivies. I would never argue that UW-Madison is on par with Harvard or Yale, but to say it's close (considering undergraduate studies, the graduate level, and research) isn't that outlandish. My graduate program at Madison is actually #2 in the country according to U.S. News (and I have to give another shout-out to UWM, whose graduate program in Education is #67). And the hierarchy of people judging where others went to school is endless. Harvard is arguably better than Oxford or Cambridge, but that doesn't stop those old schoolboys from turning their noses up at an education in the colonies . I wouldn't argue that Madison is overrated, but I think that UWM is severely underrated. I don't regret my undergraduate experience at all. And I agree that UWM and Milwaukee need to stop being used interchangeably. I'm surprised that the University doesn't have stronger guidelines for this (and if they actually exist, why they're not being followed).
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Post by uwmfutbol on Aug 8, 2012 9:56:46 GMT -6
"This is just my own experience. I dont know about other out of staters or what in staters deal with. The other reason i am for dropping the W ( when i say that i dont mean completely dropping it just start going by university of Milwaukee and/or milwaukee a lot more.) because its wordy and doesn't flow well in my opinion."
Agreed. When I lived in D.C. my colleagues and professors didn't even know that UW was in Madison. They just associated it as Wisconsin. That's why they need the brand to be Milwaukee. Consider the UC schools. UC-Irvine is UCI. UC-Los Angeles (God, that sounds weird) is UCLA. UC-Berkeley is just Berkeley. The acronym doesn't work because the M could be Madison. No one will confuse the name Milwaukee.
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