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Post by gman2 on Apr 13, 2011 10:18:54 GMT -6
I once again will bring State Fair Park Milwaukee Mile into the discussion. I know the City of West Allis has other plans for the Mile, but the Mile has the following going for it:
= Is north-south oriented
= Relatively easy freeway access
= Has relatively new seating
= Relatively new press box.
= Plenty of parking for tailgating
= Onsite facilities for pre and post game festivities
= Bars on Greenfield Ave for pre and post game festivities
The seating around the turns could be moved to the east side of the field. State Fair Park allows for game day to be more than the actual game, it can become an event. You could even make this a shared football-soccer facility. MSL?
I don't think the amount of fans needed to support football are going to travel to the east side of Milwaukee. I could see fans traveling to a regional central point like State Fair Park.
Just one man's humble thoughts.
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Rawls
Junior
Everyone's Entitled To My Opinion
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Post by Rawls on Apr 13, 2011 11:22:31 GMT -6
I'm right with Costello on this one. Football is a goal in the long term, but that's about it. Drum up spirit from alumni and students, become a profitable program, and then see what we can work out.
I would want something closer to campus, and more football-oriented than State Fair Park. As a short term place it's fine, and even then it'd need some significant renovations.
Looking at the success of Boise St at the FBS level and EWU at the FCS level, I say we install bright gold turf. [/sarcasm]
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Post by tyrunner0097 on Apr 13, 2011 11:44:38 GMT -6
I agree this should be something to seriously consider in the next 5-10 years...I mentioned this to a few old-timers and they remember how bitter it was when MU dropped its football program...Seems like Milwaukee has lost something with the lack of college football...Would be nice to get it back...
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Post by gman2 on Apr 13, 2011 11:50:31 GMT -6
To me closeness to campus isn't as important. I would like to think the cost of reconfiguring the Mile for a football stadium would be less than some of the options posted on here.
As for on campus arena, I personally have no huge issue with the US Cellular Arena. Yes it could use some updates, but I do like the location. I know many UWM alumni and spouses of alumni, that believe the Arena is perfectly fine for the Men's basketball program. They say that Milwaukee should instead work with the Arena to make changes that better accommodate Men's basketball. No need to build something new. The on campus arena likely will be a case where a few donors with big bucks will make it happen because the community at large doesn't see a need.
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Post by panthersteve on Apr 13, 2011 12:10:55 GMT -6
Wish I could read Rick's mind after he visits Hank Aaron Field for the first time...a disgrace
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Post by tyrunner0097 on Apr 13, 2011 12:43:55 GMT -6
Wish I could read Rick's mind after he visits Hank Aaron Field for the first time...a disgrace More like something that makes crap look acceptable. |
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Post by buppie05 on Apr 13, 2011 13:02:17 GMT -6
To me closeness to campus isn't as important. I would like to think the cost of reconfiguring the Mile for a football stadium would be less than some of the options posted on here. As for on campus arena, I personally have no huge issue with the US Cellular Arena. Yes it could use some updates, but I do like the location. I know many UWM alumni and spouses of alumni, that believe the Arena is perfectly fine for the Men's basketball program. They say that Milwaukee should instead work with the Arena to make changes that better accommodate Men's basketball. No need to build something new. The on campus arena likely will be a case where a few donors with big bucks will make it happen because the community at large doesn't see a need. I think you may be missing the point on the Cell. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the major issue with the cell is that its a money pit, and one of the major reasons our athletics is so far in debt. An on campus arena for uwm would be like one of us buying new solar panels for our home. Its a big pain in the ass to come up with the 20K, but it sure is nice to never have to send WE energies a check again, and eventually it will pay for itself. Not only that, but we have much more control with an on campus arena, and student attendance will significantly increase. The Hank is outdated and the Cell is no longer feasible. I say do massive renovation to the Hank, build an on campus arena, and after that if the Milwaukee Mile is available the University should pursue buying it for football or otherwise. Its a big chunk of land in a great location, and I'm with Gman in thinking it would be ideal for college football. |
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Rawls
Junior
Everyone's Entitled To My Opinion
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Post by Rawls on Apr 13, 2011 13:30:20 GMT -6
The first thing we need to work out is spirit. Absolutely and Unequivocally. Gman raises a good point about community desires. Hell, the community around us was against freaking lights at Engelmann. But if we can get the 30k students and 100k alumni here to get fired up, the general public will follow. Change public perception, because as of now anything and everything Milwaukee might try will be rejected.
To put it bluntly, the success of our men's basketball team is crucial to any discussion of football being a reality. A winning team will bring in more fan support, more donor money, and more advertising revenue than any other support by far.
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Post by gman2 on Apr 13, 2011 13:34:20 GMT -6
Solar panels are a bad analogy. In Wisconsin solar panels can be a supplemental power source but will never be a base power source. You would never recoup the cost to make solar panels a base power source. You will still send money to WE Energies.
Better analogy might be renting versus owning.
A lot of assumptions are made about an on campus arena. Student attendance will increase. Since students get in free, they must be expected to pour a lot of money into concessions (or students fees) to make up for the lack of ticket revenue. Overall attendance will increase. It's not as easy to get to campus and parking may be an issue, will that impact attendance? As far as control, how much less control do we really have at the Cell? I do not know the answer. Someone must have an answer.
Maybe the University should consider buying the Cell? With all the money we have contributed to the Cell through rent payment, we can get a deal on the Cell like Michael Cudahy got on the Pabst.
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Post by Super King on Apr 13, 2011 14:16:37 GMT -6
Except the Cell is too big. We shouldn't invest all that money in a building we'll never fill up.
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Post by BBFran on Apr 13, 2011 14:26:47 GMT -6
I am flabbergasted at the suggestion of State Fair Park as a football site for UWM. An odd, decrepit facility 10 miles from campus? You think it's hard getting students to the Cell?
This is all a pipe dream anyway. There will be no serious discussion or effort put into football for years. Probably many years.
Don't get me wrong -- I would love to see our athletic program get to the point some day that we could seriously entertain the discussion. I just recognize we are talking about a very long lead time.
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mwu
Sophomore
I am U-Dub U-M
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Post by mwu on Apr 13, 2011 14:43:57 GMT -6
Solar panels are a bad analogy. In Wisconsin solar panels can be a supplemental power source but will never be a base power source. You would never recoup the cost to make solar panels a base power source. You will still send money to WE Energies. While this was true through the mid-1990's, that statement is no longer true. anyways, besides the point... on basketball: ideally a new on-campus arena should be built. "on-campus" can also mean that the U buy land (various possible locations) and expand campus like we did with the north ave. dorms, glrf, public health, engineering, and usr locations. if a new arena is out of the question i would support revamping the cell over klotsche. on baseball: i really don't see miller park as a realistic, full-time option. playing some home games there would be great in early in the season so the boys don't have to play on the road for 2 months. but as a whole i can't see it working out. i mean we feel like the cell is empty with 6-7000 seats vacant, think how empty 40K vacant seat @ miller park. on football: yes it would be cool. yes they should share with an mls team. yes it would be great for the U. i very much dislike the idea of them playing @ state fair in a racing venue. sight lines are going to be horrible, no shelter for fans from the elements, the proportions are going to be way off. plus, if kids don't like busing/driving to games @ the cell, they're gonna hate trekking out to the fair grounds. |
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Post by gman2 on Apr 13, 2011 15:23:35 GMT -6
I am flabbergasted at the suggestion of State Fair Park as a football site for UWM. An odd, decrepit facility 10 miles from campus? You think it's hard getting students to the Cell? This is all a pipe dream anyway. There will be no serious discussion or effort put into football for years. Probably many years. Don't get me wrong -- I would love to see our athletic program get to the point some day that we could seriously entertain the discussion. I just recognize we are talking about a very long lead time. I'm not talking about football at the Mile in it's current configuration. Racing at the Mile is history, they are lucky to get one or two events a year. End all racing and put the facility to use strictly for football and possibly soccer. Odd and Decrepit? They spent how many millions tearing down the old grandstand and renovating the entire seating area, concessions, rest rooms and other areas. As far as odd, not sure what you are alluding to. Obviously there would need to be changes to the current configuration to accommodate football, but you have something to work from. You have the base configuration in place, a 25,000 seat center grandstand. What other facility in the area has 25,000 relatively new seats in a north-south configuration? You have easy access to I-94. You have a underrated area of bars and restaurants within walking distance. I've been to one race event since the renovation. This is not the old Milwaukee Mile. They had all sorts of activities surrounding the race event. It was actually pretty cool seeing all they had to offer fans prior to and during the race event. I could see that same thing for football. Pre-game events that could be held. If anyone thinks that people will come to a Milwaukee football game simply for the sport event itself, good luck getting people to go. This is Milwaukee. The Brewers have set a standard for sports entertainment in this area. The sport event itself is not enough, there needs to be amenities for the fans. For Brewer fans it is obviously tailgating pre-game and loge level milling about during the game. For families there is the kids zone. Give people something to do other than the sport event. I know football would be something many, many years away. But if they are serious, don't discount what the Milwaukee Mile offers as a place for football. Would it work? Maybe not. But it does have things in place that make it attractive. As far as getting students to games? I know it's not hard getting students to Miller Park. On any given non-rainy day Brewer game you will probably find more students in attendance than all the Men's basketball home games combined (with the exception of the Horizon League Tournament). Why? Because of what you can do that is not related to the game. I'm guessing same thing for football. UCLA appears to do fine with a stadium several miles from campus |
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Post by buppie05 on Apr 13, 2011 16:22:39 GMT -6
I don't know why we are even discussing the merits of an on-campus arena, its a forgone conclusion that we need our own arena, and people in authority at UWM realize this. Its not just the explicit costs of rent vs. ownership, but several other opportunity costs are involved in not having an on-campus arena, costs that Jimmy and others on here have gone over.
As far as the Milwaukee Mile goes, there are several factors making this a favorable site. Would an on-campus football stadium be better? Of course, but if we are having a hard time finding a site/money for an on-campus basketball arena, an on-campus football venue made from scratch is going to give us nightmares. As mentioned, the facilities at the mile aren't that bad, and a race venue in Milwaukee has become near obsolete. I feel like 5-10 years down the road if football is feasible for UWM, the money and effort needed to transform the mile, as opposed to starting from scratch elsewhere, will make a lot of sense to consider it as an option.
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Post by uwmfutbol on Apr 14, 2011 7:51:54 GMT -6
I've been hesitant to participate in this discussion primarily because I just don't see football ever happening at UWM and I'm not going to get my hopes up. Until the perception regarding UWM as both a sports program and an academic institution changes, the money isn't going to ever flow in. I've been saying for years that the apathy on campus and in the surrounding community is what does us in. It's a vicious cycle. If we can't get 4000 fans to come to a division 1 basketball game, how can we possibly think we're going to get 10,000+ to come to the Milwaukee Mile? Also, I don't think Wisconsin is a "football-crazy" state. The Badgers and Packers are extremely popular, but we're nowhere near the insanity you see in states like Texas and Georgia.
Without the money (and we need A LOT of it), this is a pipe dream. Let's "settle" for an on-campus arena and getting the baseball team a new home. If football does return, I'll be thrilled, but I don't see it.
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