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Post by formerseasonticketholder on Jan 20, 2011 19:12:08 GMT -6
How do feel our Panthers are doing at rebounding?
It seems to me it's been a long time since there's been a player that has really made a commitment to crash the boards.
For a while I had hoped Ant Hill would become that guy. Now it appears that hope was misplaced (0 at DePaul, 3 vs Loyola).
Next to being a scoring machine I can't imagine a faster way to a coach's heart than collecting 6-12 boards a game night in and night out. I'm sure a player that decided he was going to become the guy to do it would also get a few put backs in each game as well.
Would a decent rebounding average (six or more a game) and six or eight points be enough to earn one of our reserves more minutes? I think it probably would.
I'd love to see Ryan Allen or Kyle Kelm decide to take on this role.
Do you think either of them, or maybe someone else on the current roster will make the commitment to become a great rebounder?
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Post by Super King on Jan 20, 2011 19:58:53 GMT -6
I'd rather have a complete rebounding team than a complete rebounding player, and I'd rather have a player with a complete game than a player who focuses more on rebounding. But let's look at numbers, in terms of rebounds per minute:
Hill: .22 (leading rebounder)
Boga: .20
Meier: .18
Kelm: .17
Williams: .16
Allen: .16
Haggerty: .15 (limited minutes)
Wolf: .15 (limited minutes)
Boyle: .09
Conversely, let's analyze the stats for Valpo, Butler and Cleveland State, all teams with better rebounds per game numbers than us:
Valpo (more rebounds per game than UWM):
Rogers: .21 (8th in minutes)
Van Wijk: .19
Little: .17 (leading rebounder)
Johnson: .17
Wood: .14
Kenney: .14
Broekhoff: .14
Butler:
Howard: .26 (leading rebounder)
Marshall: .25 (7th in minutes)
Smith: .23
Anglin: .16 (limited minutes)
Fromm: .16 (limited minutes)
Mack: .15
Vanzant: .13
Stigall: .11
Nored: .11
Cleveland State:
Pogue: .26 (leading rebounder)
Latas: .21 (8th in minutes)
Woods: .21
McCoy: .18 (7th in minutes)
Cole: .16
Kamczyc: .14
Harmon: .13 (third-most rebounds!)
Montgomery: .10
Top-to-bottom, we're actually deeper with rebounders than any of the 3 teams leading the Horizon League, despite the fact that Cleveland State and Butler are better at the top (although in Cleveland State's case, two of their top 3 rebounders don't play all that much, and 3 of their top 4 are 6th, 7th, and 8th in total minutes). Obviously there are other factors at work here, such as field goal percentage, but we're actually a team with very good rebounders -- including Hill, whom you seem to think isn't that great.
The expectation of a double-double machine is a little too much, I think. Our guard rebounding depth is fantastic (Boga in particular is a better rebounder than most forwards), and I think you're laying your expectations a little thick on Kelm -- he's a Freshman after all, and is still growing into his size and strength.
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Post by ghostofdylan on Jan 20, 2011 20:02:58 GMT -6
With 114 rebounds, Anthony Hill is currently 70 boards behind Joah Tucker (184, 2005-06) for 10th on the program's all-time Division 1 single-season list. Adrian Tigert is in first with 214 rebounds in 2004-05 and second with 212 in 2005-06.
Larry Reed dominates the school's all-time list in this category, with 462 in 1966-67, 425 in 1965-66 and 385 in 1964-65.
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Post by Super King on Jan 20, 2011 20:10:25 GMT -6
Hill's always been a great rebounder. His best year in terms of rebounds per minute of action was actually 08-09 (.26), when he averaged 5.5 PPG.
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Post by formerseasonticketholder on Jan 20, 2011 23:15:28 GMT -6
Thanks for the well-researched response SuperKing. I've never seen stats on rebounds per minute before. That's interesting.
Are those stats listed somewhere or did you generate the data yourself?
In conference play the Panthers have out rebounded opponents four times. I can't help but wonder if a few less second chance opportunities against UWGB or Loyola may not have helped the cause a bit.
Ant has had two great games cleaning the glass during conference play with 12 against Youngstown and UWGB and another very strong outing with eight against Wright State. He has also been a non factor on the boards in four games, with four boards against Detroit and Butler and three against Cleveland St and Loyola.
IMHO a team with a starting center who pulls down four boards or less per game during half of its league games has a clear need to improve, but clearly that opinion is not universal.
Regarding Kelm or Allen, expectations and being a double double machine I'd be interested to know what reasonable expectations are if six boards a game is too much to hope for from a highly touted freshman recruit like Kelm or an explosive athlete such as Allen.
In any case six points and six boards a night isn't a double double so I guess I agree with you that expecting a double double machine is a bit much.
DR, I'm not sure if you're trying to say that Ant is doing well by comparison to the school's all time greats or if you meant he's a bit behind but if we lined up Joah and Ant under the basket and I had to bet my lunch money on who was going to pull down a rebound I'm pretty sure I know who I'd take.
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Post by Super King on Jan 21, 2011 2:27:17 GMT -6
I did that research myself, which is why only four teams are represented.
I think it's important to understand we don't have a center. Hill's a power forward, and a 6.2 RPG number is pretty good for a guy in his position.
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