"Lincoln Park - Lincoln Park is located northwest of the Kenwood campus, bounded to the east by Highway 43, to the west by Green Bay Avenue, and to the south by Hampton Avenue. The site, which currently includes the UWM baseball field, is envisioned to accommodate much needed athletic expansion, particularly for baseball, tennis, soccer, track, and a practice facility.
U.S. Cellular Arena - The U.S. Cellular Arena, located in downtown Milwaukee on West State Street, currently hosts the UWM men’s basketball team. Due to the size required for this type of venue, and the continued availability of the downtown arena, UWM will continue with this use for the foreseeable future"
By the way, they spelled foreseeable wrong - (they have forseeable)
Anyways, about the scenarios. Both are predictable, and both, in my mind, are incorrect.
Post by Black PantherU on Oct 12, 2009 12:46:16 GMT -6
You can't increase seating for basketball outside of putting seats in two of the corners, and that won't make it anywhere near 5k.
The ceiling is not tall enough for an expansion like that. If men's basketball is to return and the current building is to remain standing, then the floor needs to be blasted and dropped. The equipment room and locker rooms can be moved if need be, and those classrooms that aren't used can be moved elsewhere as well.
What we can't do is pull nickel-and-dime bullsh*t and add just "possible seating increases." Koonce wants to have the best 15 sports he can, outside of adding football only building men's basketball into a powerhouse can bring in the money that the other sports need to be national programs.
It's possible to do that with the Cell, but that place would need to be overhauled to make it a better facility than the BC on a smaller scale, something I'm not sure can happen.
What I do know is that the future of athletics at UWM, if it doesn't include football for the foreseeable future, is heavily dependent on the success of men's basketball. That means two things:
1. Investment in annual budget. Koonce said during his interview process that he would like to boost the athletic budget from just under 10 million up to 13-14 million. I believe that extra 3-4 million should breakdown like this: 500k to hire support personnel. With Lautz gone, his replacement shouldn't work alone and should have an assistant. B-Mo's former job is now an internship taken by Meyer. If he does a good enough job, he should be hired full-time, as should the marketing intern spot that has been taken by Kris and Corwin in the past and now Adam. Through those three jobs (ticketing assistant, compliance assistant and marketing assistant), what's the damage, 140k at the very most? The big job that is needed is a second Associate AD. For sh*ts and giggles, let's add a third Associate. That brings it up to 250k. The rest of that 500k set aside for jobs should be to add positions in Development. Melanie is doing that job all by her lonesome. Whether she has an assistant or not, this is a program that needs to raise money constantly, and the groundwork laid by Development is needed for Koonce to step in and hit homers. Why am I bringing this up where the topic is boosting basketball? At least 2 million should be added to the men's basketball budget for recruiting, salaries, and other administrative costs. Obviously this money isn't going to happen overnight and probably not this year, but if the athletic budget is going to increase, the men's basketball budget should see the most money out of it.
2. Facilities built ON-CAMPUS for basketball. The university can't afford to throw money away at the Cell annually. That's fine if Koonce can wine and dine and lower the rent there, but at the end of the day here is the fact: the university's main pull in bringing alumni and the community on-campus is not on-campus.
We don't have football. That's fine for now. But men's basketball needs the investment to become a NATIONAL program. That's where the money will come for other sports, through the Panther Fund. And that won't come without a dynamite basketball program. How is that going to come? Facilities and an increased recruiting and salary budget.
Basketball (both men's and women's) should have its own practice facility as part of the Klotsche Center. I don't mean that it should be an auxiliary gym off the side of the arena. I mean it should be team locker rooms (moved from the Pavilion to be closer to the facility), basketball-only weight room, video room, lounges, study rooms, and coaches' offices. Some of those things are taken care of by the Pavilion, but it would be preferable if they were all together (instead of weight room 3rd floor, locker rooms 2nd floor, offices 1st floor, practice facility 2nd floor far away).
Invest in basketball and we will reap the rewards.
Here are a list of practice and academic facilities, to give you an idea of where UWM should be headed. Some of the things listed for these places are already done well in the Pavilion. They range from the ridiculously expensive (Duke, Kentucky) to the surprisingly cheap but well done (Wright State, Gonzaga, Memphis, Kansas)
Post by panthersteve on Oct 12, 2009 15:21:53 GMT -6
Jimmy, totally agree with everything above... Only caveat is that our poor baseball program more than anyone should get the first chunk of money in the form of a decent facility. I am amazed and ashamed at the same time how these guys persevere and over-acheive in the crap disgrace of a facility which is barely high school quality... brutal ... long overdue...Henry Aaron field... what a joke... Hank would throw up if he saw what has his name on it..l
While I agree that we ultimately need a real on-campus arena, an interim approach that expands capacity a little in the Klotsche (and otherwise spiffs it up) so the games could be played on campus is a reasonable next step. That will presumably build interest and excitement and create more pressure for a dedicated new (or at least rebuilt) facility.
I'm no engineer, but it seems to me that if the K Center could expand south, the footprint would be big enough for a rebuild that could take us to 6,000 seats or so (which would be okay). But the other part of the problem is, would this still be a multi-use facility? Because that just doesn't really work if you are trying to elevate the hoops program. It's ridiculous how the basketball team has to compete with such other interests as intramural touch football for court time. And I agree with you Jimmy -- without football (and I've got news for you -- that ain't gonna happen) men's basketball is the bell cow and the administration has to support it as the cornerstone of the athletics program.
Now we just need to find that $30 million bucks somewhere, and the administration needs to be ready to stare down the inevitable kvetching from the neighbors who think they shouldn't be inconvenienced in any way by the 25,000 student University they decided to move next to.
To me, it's utterly ridiculous that the state's second biggest University (by far) doesn't have a real on campus arena, not just for basketball but for campus events (such as commencements or convocations or speeches or concerts). State government has treated us like we're Oshkosh or Stout.
"She would constantly try to throw [Coach Jeter] off and create distractions," said another source who worked in the athletic department and no longer is at UWM. "All the time. It was bad. I felt bad for him all the time. I told him, 'You're a bigger man than I am.' It was brutal. Sabotage was in the cards." -- From the JS story, March 17, 2016
Post by baseballops on Oct 12, 2009 20:51:08 GMT -6
The Klotsche Expansion south was the explored option by Bud and Steve Mohar, director of Recreational Sports and Facilities. George had very minimal input into the master plan, it's a surprise they even included the small portion regarding Lincoln Park.
The cost of renovating/expanding Klotsche is equal to the cost of building a McCarthey Center. The first major item on George's list is the athletic complex for all of our other sports that are in need of facilities: Baseball, Track, Tennis, and eventually soccer.
As far as hiring, you touched on a few key areas, but neglected that our 325 student athletes only have 1 academic adviser serving their needs (missed class policy, assist with class scheduling, APR, etc). As we discuss hiring, you need to look at the office space itself...in the short time we've been in the building (2006) we've already outgrown the space that was several years out of date at the time of construction. Growing the budget is vital but we need more than Men's Basketball to bear that burden. If we have 4 strong smaller revenue sports, they can help cover if the Basketball program has a down year. We need to build a solid foundation to the pyramid if we plan on keeping them on a pedestal.
Post by Black PantherU on Oct 13, 2009 0:26:41 GMT -6
My discussion for the budget benefiting men's basketball was based on the Athletic Village being separate money, from donors and from Santiago's general building fund. That's why I didn't mention baseball or the other sports. You obviously know where I stand on the baseball stadium. I still think you need to explore a dome.
Here's a redo for the Klotsche Center. Women's Volleyball and Basketball move games to MSOE's Kern Center for 1-2 years during construction. The Klotsche Center Arena floor is dropped, removing the equipment room, racketball courts, and locker rooms to be moved elsewhere in the renovated or rebuilt facility.
The Norris Center is flattened, and becomes space between the planned addition to Enderis and the planned expansion of the KC. That extra space, on the south end of the building, becomes the basketball area. Coaches offices for basketball move to the south end of the building, as do men's basketball locker and lounge rooms. That frees up 5 offices for men's basketball and 4 offices for women's basketball, giving you 9 offices for other sports or new positions, Ops.
Plus, by adding a practice facility with its own basketball courts, meeting rooms, video rooms, and weight room (not necessary but preferable), you're taking away many of the distractions surrounding basketball. Here's a scene that Ops knows very well:
January Xth. Men's basketball on the main court, practicing. Women's basketball on side court, practicing. Each are separated by a nylon net, floor to ceiling. Those also separate the courts from the track, where runners are pounding the floor. Outside of the track is a batting cage, where baseball hitters are hitting against a machine, one at a time.
See the distractions? Just by removing basketball and putting it off in its own practice gym, you take one headache out of the equation. It's really nuts when all of these teams are in the Klotsche Center together. Oh yeah, Intramural sports and club sports would also like to use the floor at some time.
I didn't include baseball in my last diatribe because I figure that's a given by now, that baseball, soccer, track, and tennis will all be moved out to Lincoln Park and each will have its own facility. This, in turn, makes way for the arena to be redone like McCarthey in Spokane, except volleyball will also be housed here (I actually thought it would be cool if volleyball were relocated to the gym in Engelmann Hall and seats were added in there to give them their own home facility, but that's just me). 6-7,000 seat arena, with all the bells and whistles that a NATIONAL program would be able to provide its guests.
Need further reason to extract basketball from this mess? Watch this video by women's basketball's Stephanie Schell and you'll get why basketball needs a practice facility TODAY:
"Lincoln Park - Lincoln Park is located northwest of the Kenwood campus, bounded to the east by Highway 43, to the west by Green Bay Avenue, and to the south by Hampton Avenue. The site, which currently includes the UWM baseball field, is envisioned to accommodate much needed athletic expansion, particularly for baseball, tennis, soccer, track, and a practice facility."
To those who say a football facility would cost too much... if we're already building a new soccer field, how much more could it really cost to put 7,500-seat grandstands on each side to bring it to the minimum standards needed for FBS football? Certianly much less than the cost of a brand new venue to facilitate a dying collegiate sport in the upper midwest (baseball).
Any news on the rumored updated UWM Athletics Master Plan alledgedly to be released in March , 2012?
Good call. I was wondering that as well.
Initially, the Athletics Department announced that its Master Plan would be released by the end of 2011. Then the release date was pushed back to January, 2012 and then it was later announced that the Master Plan wouldn’t be released until sometime in March, 2012. It’s now April, 2012 and there’s no word on the release of the Master Plan.